Anyway for the rest of you, especially the Americans who will or may know the difference, I am a classical liberal which does not equal a liberal democrat, in any modern sense.

Ymarsk (easier to write):

I had no illusions, but my job for near two decades was to make disagreeable people agreeable. I think the internet has given a life to people that would otherwise be walked away from at parties or other social events as too boorish to tolerate. I would surely kick someone out of my house if they claimed that they could do as they pleased in my house and continually insulted me to boot. Churlish lout.

“On a Gaza Beach” I did manipulate him to get him to explode. It was child’s play. Two comments and the head ruptures.

Neo’s right to block the trolls and they are just that, trolls. I had hopes.

Fact Sheet
Halliburton’s Iraq Contracts Now Worth over $10 Billion

The value of Halliburton’s Iraq contracts has crossed the $10 billion threshold. Halliburton has now received $8.3 billion in Iraq work under its LOGCAP troop support contract and $2.5 billion under its no-bid Restore Iraqi Oil (RIO) contract, a total of $10.8 billion.

The mounting value of the contracts has been accompanied by a growing list of concerns about Halliburton’s performance. Over the last year, government auditors have issued at least nine reports criticizing Halliburton’s Iraq work, and there are multiple criminal investigations into overcharging and kickbacks involving Halliburton’s contracts. Former Halliburton employees have testified before Congress about egregious instances of over billing. Despite these concerns, the Bush Administration continues to reject the recommendations of its auditors that 15% of Halliburton’s LOGCAP reimbursements be withheld until the company can provide better substantiation for its charges.

So you are saying it isn’t racist? I wonder if I was to put up a web site dedicated to the Haditha story as espoused by the victims relatives and then put photos of American kids with guns or at NRA rallies, or kids in KKK garb or cowboy costumes with guns, that would be OK too?

Maybe we could add a few pics of American neoNazis and have those twins’ mp3 embedded in the page. That of course would be perfectly fair by your reasoning.

The reason is simple. There are specific things that you cannot talk about to Confud, or else he will blow up on you and engage his prejudices in overdrive.

If you were just talking about yourself, and not Confud’s support columns like Palestinians and racism, then Confud can talk to you like a normal person. But the moment you get out of line, he comes down like a load of bricks on you.

Once you have a person’s psychology nailed down, not only are they predictable but they are completely open to annihilation attacks.

What the heck are annihilation attacks? These attacks are designed as such to destroy a person from the inside out. You start with their key beliefs, destroy them, and their entire edifice will implode on itself. But you can’t do this with just words, words has never convinced the true believer, the fanatic, or the religious zealot. You need something more. Something that is so psychologically traumatic, that either the target reenergizes his conscience and changes, or the target goes into a coma.

It is sad to say,but the people who like America the most are the ones who live the crappiest of lives under the regimes that are anti-American. They see the truth and can never deny it. You can’t make someone living in peace and prosperity, protected by the American Navy, to like America. Obviousness is not enough, psychological trauma must be necessary for those who have integrated so much anti-American philosophy or socialist beliefs. Or in Confud’s case, pro-Palestinian jihad beliefs.

There comes a point when your beliefs become your identity. And therefore once someone understands your beliefs (such as love for your child), then that person can destroy you by destroying your beliefs. Or making use of your beliefs to destroy you. Either way, the end goal is accomplished.

I’m sorry I’ve wasted valuable time with you. If my family is at threat because of your beliefs, then a curse on your family is in order I believe.

Confud feels betrayed by Ariel’s words. Which I thought was quite overly cautious in making things clear and inoffensive.

Why then does Confud feel betrayed? Because Confud thought Ariel was a reasonable person, that he could talk to. And a reasonable person would never disagree with Confud on the things that he has believed in in his heart, now would they? So when that reasonable person believes in something that Confud considers taboo, Confud believes he has been betrayed.

Confud is correct, but Confud should realize that his own beliefs and integrity betrayed him, not the beliefs and integrity of Ariel.

Such is psychology, useful but not a godlike cure.

That doesn’t make Ymar or Sally not racist scum.

Your argument is, sadly, a pathetic demonstration of neocon ultranationalist hypocrisy and rhetoric.

I’m sorry I’ve wasted valuable time with you. If my family is at threat because of your beliefs, then a curse on your family is in order I believe. You are no better than OBL or the idiots blowing up people in Iraq (oh. wait you are blowing up people in Iraq).

No salutations.

If you beleive in liberal democracy you are obliged to question the centers of power. You seem to have layed down and decayed.

So, you aren’t a liberal democrat you are a pathetic parody of your own rhetoric.

I hope your ill health is short lived.

Confudeforeigner,

Boy you just can’t give ground on much can you? I wasn’t defending Malkin, I was disagreeing with your interpretation. There is a difference, subtle but there. Quick test: two pictures, one an Aborigine being beating into submission by a white Aussie, the other a white Aussie being beaten into submission by another white. The racist will blame the Aborigine, the race-baiter will see White Racism, the rest of us will wonder what the guy said/did to make the other so angry, or just think the beater is a violent jerk. I’m in the third group, which are you? Only you can know.

Oh, that little voice you hear in the very still hours of the night, that whisper “you might have misjudged, you might be wrong…” it’s not a psychotic episode, it’s your conscience.:>)

I never brought up Nasser’s folly of Pan-Arabism. Only you did. I was thinking only of the regimes that have used this as the reason for “we will drive them into the sea”. I believe the original reason was “Islamic land cannot be given up”. Thus my cynicism about the Arab regimes and the Palestinian Arabs, I don’t believe they give a crap about them either. One pretext is as good as another. The Arabs (locally, not regimes) tried the same thing in the 1920’s and failed then. Something you forget, or omit, is that the Israeli’s were not always backed by the US (think Mirage), but that another superpower was backing the Arabs in the 50’s and 60’s. It must be humiliating to be beaten by Jews over and over again.

The Mandate must be followed. All sides must agree to the existence of the other, yes the palestinian arabs should have a homeland and Israel should continue to exist. If the two sides could work together that region could be one of the most prosperous in the world. Instead of a hell hole for all concerned. I really don’t want Arab kids being shot, or Jewish kids shredded by bombs.

You dismiss history, but that is the context. To ignore it is, well, you know. Don’t read yesterday’s paper if you dismiss history.

Saddam financed suicide-bombers by monetary gifts to the families. Recent Iraqi documents that show Saddam did not have WMDs, but acted like it, also revealed closer ties to terrorist groups than you would agree with. Saddam would also train to fight terrorists while supporting it elsewhere, knowing his regime would be unacceptable at some point. If you missed it, he started acting more Muslim for show the last years of his regime. Like some of our past presidents who were really marginal as Christians but put on a good show. It is more complex than you let on, which surprises the hell out of me given some of your insight. We all filter through premises, preconceptions, and prejudices. Most often they serve us, sometimes they fail us.

Brad had commented earlier that your understanding of racism might be, uh, less than sophisticated. Your “we have less, rednecks, were so urbanized” so we are less racist is naive at best. Racism comes in many forms. You can call this arrogant, but Americans have been fighting this issue since before 1791 and we may just have a more sophisticated view of racism than the rest of you. It would take a hell of a lot of reading on your part just to scratch the surface of the American experience on this issue. It is height of arrogance of the rest of the world to think they know more, or have more than a superficial understanding of my country. We are so much more nuanced than you guys ever give us credit. I may of course misunderstand what you meant.

So, being a “redneck” kid that shucked corn, candled eggs, culled potatoes, raised calves, goats, chickens, had a stupid mule that would step on his feet so I’d keep brushing him, helped pick, crate and load my uncle’s strawberry crop, had a father and stepmother that picked cotton (no they weren’t black), I just can’t understand why my best friend in 2nd grade was a Sioux, or the kids I played baseball with all the time were all Latino (we called them Mexicans back then), or why I had a crush on a black girl in my Sophmore year, or even why my highschool girlfriend was Jewish. Now, I just can’t figure out why the last three sleepovers at my house were two Hindu kids (vegetarians are hard to feed) and a black kid. Being a “redneck” kid, I’m still trying to figure out why I live in a neighborhood with a black neighbor, the gay couple across the street, the newly arrived Ukranians, and the Russians whose lovely little daughter plays with my daughters, or why I talked all the time to my Assyrian grocer and his wife. Being a “redneck” kid, I still can’t figure out why I have 2000 books (last count) in my home, or how the hell I aced a senior level history course on the Soviet Union without reading the 15 assigned books (I’d read them in the military, no wonder it was hard getting the next security clearance with those books in my locker), or got a degree in engineering. I’m still hoping my wife’s nephew will marry his black girlfriend, the fool doesn’t know what he has. But you know those American rednecks, we have so many of them. I really hate labels.

Tell your Muslim friends Americans fought in Bosnia to save muslims, we died in Somolia (stupid cut-and-run) and, maybe, just maybe, Iraq will again have that functioning democracy it had from 1921 until 1958 (59?).
Tell them that democracy is compatible with Islam, but they know that, and their enemies are the muslims that say it isn’t.

Personally, I still have reservations about Islam. But then my aunt was 1st generation Armenian-American, so I heard a lot of stories as a young boy…

Have a safe trip. Stay on the board (I prefer motorcycles). Hug your kids both ways.

To everyone else, I apologize for this long rant.

Douglas, you know, I reckon that that is the dumbest question I’ve ever been asked. It is not only a dumb question but the tone of it makes you sound like you are thinking that you are scoring a goal, whereas, it is a spectacular own goal.

The implication was overt and clear. What a donkey you are.

A: Because thay’d only have two senators.

Boom boom.

2:33 AM, June 07, 2006

Look, I am suspicious of that sort of evidence no matter what side it comes from. There are too many blanks in it to speculate.

I’m sorry but it is no ‘proof’ at all.

The Geneva Conventions are quite specific either way, and who knows horse from cart.

Certainly, allegations and reports of IDF targeting of ambulances started long before the IDF started claiming the current story and it is suspicious that the IDF has offered no evidence let alone proof.

Why is it that you can argue with Israelis about these things but not Americans?

My defence of the Palestinian PEOPLE (remember that word) is neither blind nor without reservation and knowledge of the sins committed in their name and by (some) of them.

Your tax dollars are paying for their oppessors’ sins (both Arab and Israeli, but mostly Israeli) and you are doing it ‘unconditionally’. Think about that. That is ammoral unquestioned support no matter what.

I urge you to read widely of the facts regarding Israel’s short bloody history Douglas. And read it with some empathy for the human beings involved.

Personally, I don’t think you can or will.

None the less, it is still non-sequitur. You still seem to miss the point that if the Israelis did something wrong, it changes nothing about palestinian sins- or does it? What then do you say about Haditha?

Why always the blind defense of the palestinians?

How about a real answer this time?

What, no balls?

I don’t think you can count Reuters among the organs of the United States government.

Don’t be so sure Doug, you never know when “we” might have the Zionists use their tentacles to infiltrate Al Reuters as a double blind.

“Why do you lay these troubles on an already troubled mind?” Can you not see? Your uncle is wearied by your malcontent, your warmongering.”

Why wouldn’t they? Saddam was ruthless with islamists and jihadis. That is one of the great ironies of all this warmongering. You’ve been had.

As for the ambulance story, I played rugby with one of the Fijians that was there AND I’ve seen the video.

I’ve worked on a project to fund some of the refugees from Israeli aggression and expansionism in South Lebanon and Syria.

Did you know that your own troops have been attacked by the IDF?

Dismiss it as will be your wish.

I doubt that you’ll want to read this, but I’ll put it up anyway.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/anomalous/138519847/

I don’t think that’s really a response to Ariel, was it meant to be?

Curiously then, It came from a Reuters cameraman, probably appalled at the sanctity of the ambulance being violated. I don’t think you can count Reuters among the organs of the United States government. As for it ‘proving nothing’, I beg to differ. At a minimum, it proves that palestinian militants have no regard for the sanctity of the ambulance, and thereby endanger many other people on both sides.

“If you care to cast your mind back to before the Iraq invasion, we were shown a video which according to ‘US sources’ ie probably Rove’s White House Iraq Group ‘proved beyond doubt’ that Iraq was training terrorists in hostage taking on aircraft.

The only problem was, that it was Iraqi training video of antiterrorism troop training at their purpose built facility. (I can’t remember the name of the place. Om something)”

Why would Iraq be doing anti-terrorism training of this nature?
It’s also classic non-sequitur. There’s also a hugh difference between a Reuters news camera 20 feet from the action and a satellite or drone reconnasiance aircraft video…but again, non-sequitur.

“It is incumbent on the IDF to answer the UN and Red Cross’s demand for evidence, not to play propaganda games via youtube. If they have evidence the Red Cross would like to see it. Unless you think the Red Cross is part of the great arab conspiracy.”

You keep mentioning the UN and Red Cross/Crescent’s call for evidence- You fail to mention that it was about specific allegations of a UN ambulance being used to transport weapons, which was based on thin drone video evidence. The UN maintains that they do not support the militants with transport via ambulance, and so, for now, I’ll take them at their word, but that was not the issue. If militants force drivers to take them, it still violates and negates the sanctity of the ambulance. Why you cannot concede this point is beyond me. Is your entire world view so brittle?

As for your unsourced cut and paste of the ambulance attack, If it is as you portray it, it’s criminal. It is also non-sequitur to this discussion. Please try to engage us in a way that seeks clarity, not obfuscation, because ultimately, that will be seen as a dishonest position in itself.

The injustice of the Palestinian tragedy is the weeping sore that is surely the rallying call for all Muslim extremists. You are effectively talking about 6 million refugees under constant military threat in perpetuity.

The injustice is blatant, palpable and demonstrably barbaric. The hypocrisy is astounding given the context of the creation of Israel. Utterly mind numbingly astounding.

And no will to fix it. None. In fact you are paying for it lock, stock and barrell. Blaming other arabs (or more correctly their regimes) for it doesn’t help the Palestinians and they actually didn’t create the mess in the first place. The whole pan Arab nonsense is just that. Nonsense.

The extremists using it are just as scathing of their own regimes and are actually fighting them as well.

That is where it gets too complicated for the little dears in here because it it can’t be any simpler than us vs them. And the current ‘them’ is muslims.

And at the end of the day, whatever the history, there are 6 million people being screwed right now and we’re sitting back watching them (and in your case paying) get it.

They don’t have any oil though, so………….

It might have something to do with all those sharks swimming around.

10:28 PM, June 05, 2006

Ymarsakar said…
I would add that New Zealanders too, but I think they might be a tad miffed if I compared them to Australians.

10:29 PM, June 05, 2006

And so it begins. Well done Yfronts for confirming my belief in you.

Yawn.

How terrifying for you. There there it’ll be alright. GWB and Halliburton and Bechtel will save you. And you’ll get a tax cut if you’re rich enough, for your trouble.

Tax cuts? Hurrah! Hurrah!

It might have something to do with all those sharks swimming around.

Confudeforeigner,
The Khmer Rouge were linked originally. They were an offshoot in 1959 of the Indochinese Communist Party, est. 1931 under the auspices of the Stalinists. There may have been some name changes after 59 , Khmer Rouge is the name the French gave them. The Vietnamese aided them, militarily and supples, in their fight to topple the Cambodian government, until the Khmer Rouge won in 1975. Went sour after that, Cambodians had some old grudges against the Vietnamese, could be because the Vietnamese thought they were destined to rule all of Indochina or whatever other old issues. The Cambodians claimed territory claimed by the Vietnamese, in 1979 the Vietnamese squashed their creation. Friends and buddies, then enemies. The Communists always ate their own. See the term “Revisionist” as coined by Lenin. Lot of old Bolsheviks died by that label.
As for Jenin, at least you didn’t throw out the “500″ were massacred which was a disgusting propaganda ploy immediately after. I’ve read accounts and assessments on both sides of the issue. All supposedly independent. One thing I don’t care for is how “guerillas” use civilian populations as shields. All sides may have blame here. The Israelis do need to clean up their act, but the Arabs need to accept them also. Arab anti-semitism (hate that stupid phrase, anti-judaism perhaps?) started well before the formation of Israel.

Read the history of this region starting about 1890-1900. The British did their usual botch up. The Hashemites had a greater claim to Arabia than the Sauds, they shouldn’t be ruling Jordan. The League of Nations Mandate should have been recognized, honored, and accomplished by all sides before the end of the 20s. I will not address the moral issue of all this simply because by not doing this an even greater moral issue was created. And their fellow Arabs have used the Palestinian Arabs as pawns just as much as the British used the Arabs. The Ottomans should have picked a better side in WWI.

I know its callous. But how many injustices do you wish to fight? The Armenians, Ukranians, Assyrians, Kurds, Sanids, Hottentots, I can make a damn long list, and with few exceptions (the Sanids), they too owe others. Which date and which map should we select? Should the Islamic Arabs give up the Christian areas they invaded? I know a few Assyrian Christians that would like that. I don’t doubt there are a few Copts that would cheer too. But we would hurt a lot of people if we did that wouldn’t we?

I am cynical regarding all of this, obviously. Does any of this make me a “farking sick puppy”? That phrase is creative, or is it standard Aussie fare? :>)

Video footage taken by reporters at the scene shows the vehicle approaching the checkpoint at a moderate speed, with its blue flashing light and siren on, and the car packed with women and children. Other vehicles crowded with civilians, including a pick-up truck and a tractor, were travelling in convoy with the Volvo. Eye-witnesses saw two IDF helicopters (most probably Apache attack helicopters) hovering low over the area of the checkpoint. As soon as the vehicle passed the checkpoint heading north, a missile fired by one of the helicopters (most probably a laser-guided Hellfire air-to-surface missile), hit the back of the car or exploded just behind it ripping through its back door. The vehicle then crashed into a house just off the road. According to Abbas Ali Jiha, the driver:

…the ambulance was hit in the back and swung off the street. I ran from the car carrying two of my children, Mahdi [who survived] and Mariam [who died], and told the journalists that there were dead and wounded in the car.

Inside the car two women, Muna Habib Shuwayh, 28, the wife of Abbas Jiha, and Nawkha Ahmad al-Uqla, 50 (a neighbour of Abbas Jiha) were killed. Also killed were four girls: Zeinab, 10, Hanan, 5, and Mariam, 2½ months, (all daughters of Abbas Jiha) and Hudu Fadi Khalid, 11 (Nawkha al-Uqlas grand-daughter). Five other children in the car Abbas Jiha and his cousin Ali Ammar survived.

UN soldiers and other eye-witnesses who were at the scene immediately after the car was hit said that there were no weapons or any other type of military equipment in the car, only clothes and some food supplies. The video footage of the dead and wounded in the car moments after the attack supports these statements. Amnesty International has no evidence to indicate that the driver or anyone else in the car had any connection with Hizbullah. Abbas Jiha, an agricultural worker who had emigrated to Germany but returned to al-Mansuri some 15 months before Operation Grapes of Wrath, told Amnesty International that he was not a member of Hizbullah and that he was not involved in any military activity. He maintained that after the beginning of the Israeli operation he volunteered to drive the vehicle for emergency purposes such as bringing medical and food supplies to al-Mansuri, which was under sporadic bombardment. On 13 April, the day of the attack, he decided to use the vehicle to evacuate his family from the village after hearing of the IDF warnings issued on SLA radio that al-Mansuri and other villages would be attacked.

The kashafat al-risalah al-islamiyya, the Islamic Scouts charity organisation, affiliated to Amal, runs a network of ambulances and medical services in southern Lebanon and assists privately-operated ambulances by providing medical supplies and training volunteer first aiders. The vehicle itself was owned by the village community. In normal times it was parked near the mayors house who also held the keys. When Operation Grapes of Wrath began, the Islamic Scouts operation centre in Tyre took control of the al-Mansuri ambulance by supplying it with one of their regular drivers and fuel and despatching it for various humanitarian purposes. On the day of the attack the vehicle had travelled twice between Tyre and al-Mansuri. In its last trip to al-Mansuri on 13 April, Abbas Jiha drove the car to the village to evacuate his family.

Abbas Jihas two surviving sons Mahdi and Ali carrying photos of their mother Muna and sister Zeinab who were killed in the attack on the ambulance on 13 April 1996. Under international law, medical transport vehicles marked with designated symbols (including the Red Cross and Red Crescent) are protected against attack unless they are used to commit, outside their humanitarian function, acts harmful to the enemy (Article 13, Protocol 1). The circumstances surrounding the attack and IDF statements clearly suggest that the IDF wanted to hit this particular vehicle — it was not a mistake. IDF officials told Amnesty International delegates that at the time the vehicle was attacked it was being used by a Hizbullah terrorist, and that it was a rescue vehicle and not a properly marked ambulance. Public statements made by the IDF shortly after the attack refer to “a vehicle belonging to a Hizbullah terrorist”, and continue: “If other individuals were hit during the attack, they had been used by the Hizbullah as a cover for the Hizbullah activities … to the best of our knowledge the terrorist was hit.”

The IDF has produced no evidence to show that the vehicle they hit, or any other similar vehicle for that matter, had at any time been used by Hizbullah for military purposes. Independent observers interviewed by Amnesty International did suggest that Hizbullah may have misused ambulances, but did not provide specific examples to corroborate such suspicions. In any case, this vehicle was certainly engaged in legitimate humanitarian activities at the time it was hit and was travelling in a convoy of civilian vehicles away from, and not into, the area that the IDF had warned civilians to evacuate. Moreover, the Israeli helicopter crew must, at the time of the attack, have seen the ambulance markings on the vehicle. In attacking the vehicle, the IDF showed a blatant disregard for civilian lives and violated international law.
–Amnesty International

And, the hellfire missile was proved to have been issued to US Marines and dissapeared from their inventory.

My impression is that the West is being envaded by a new world order under Islam and that radicalism will increase amongst their young whilst discrimination and injustice increase and the west appeases more and more. Noone likes being bullied. And there has been a hardening since 9/11. I can feel a distinct chill toward suicide bombers where there wasn’t before.

1:51 PM, June 05, 2006

The muslims are coming! The muslims are coming!

How terrifying for you. There there it’ll be alright. GWB and Halliburton and Bechtel will save you. And you’ll get a tax cut if you’re rich enough, for your trouble.

the video of itself proves nothing. It could have come from anyone with an axe to grind.

If you care to cast your mind back to before the Iraq invasion, we were shown a video which according to ‘US sources’ ie probably Rove’s White House Iraq Group ‘proved beyond doubt’ that Iraq was training terrorists in hostage taking on aircraft.

The only problem was, that it was Iraqi training video of antiterrorism troop training at their purpose built facility. (I can’t remember the name of the place. Om something)

It is incumbent on the IDF to answer the UN and Red Cross’s demand for evidence, not to play propaganda games via youtube. If they have evidence the Red Cross would like to see it. Unless you think the Red Cross is part of the great arab conspiracy.

Anyone whose ever had anything to do with the middle east knows that arabs and the Palestinians in particular are absolutely appalling at PR and enunciating their viewpoint to the west.

Didn’t you state that virtually the entire world’s population was jealous of US money and power? An arrogant ignorant chauvanist fantasy.

Keep it up though, my wife is getting some good stuff out of your psychobabble. Her diagnosis thus far is that you are a psychotic episode waiting to happen, but more likely to harm yourself than others.

I’m warning people not to fall for it. I’ve encapsulated Confud’s first foray into this blog, here, which is all that is necessary for me. No need have I for more evidence of people arguing in bad faith.

Confud’s first foray onto this site, proof positive of bad intentions

Ariel My first post regarding Malkin, whom I neither support nor attack, was simply that I viewed it differently. … I threw race-baiter at you to see how you like it, because if you throw the term “racist” out trivially, you are a race-baiter.

In propaganda wars, in wars of psychology in which the aim is to destroy the very self-identity of the enemy then anything is game, anything can be used. Confud obviously sees specific people here as enemies, and yet others treat him as a fellow traveler among the path of war. Backstabs happen for a reason, and that reason is perhaps not so conveniently known.

At 9:24 PM, June 04, 2006, stumbley said…

Gloves off.

Does that mean we are going nuclear? Come on, where’s the nuclear MIRVs that were promised!!??

Have you noticed that you can’t seem to post anything without saying something nasty about someone. Is this what your filled with? Man, I hope you don’t do this around your children.

The psychological explanation is simple Ariel. People who aren’t confident in their personal beliefs will try to make other people comfortable with their respective beliefs, in order to bring company to misery.

Everything Confud says about respect and other reasonable things are just stuff he deceives people with, including himself. The evidence, in the link, supports my conclusion. There is no need to go past that initial first hand behavior of Confud on this site. Since it was before the insults, before the arguments, before the tempers, and before the hurling of accussations. That was, until Confud started it of course.

I don’t think Confud has inspected his own behavior with a microscope, so I don’t expect him to deny or affirm the evidence of his own conduct. But that doesn’t mean everyone will behave in the same way.

Confud’s story is reasonable on its face. He came here with curiosity in mind, was attacked as a Leftist and supporter of terroists, and therefore lashed out in justified and righteous anger.

The other, true, story is that Confud came here saying he was curious and asking questions, but when he didn’t like the answers and got to be insulting, I answered back in a calm manner that was neither hostile nor particularly argumentative. To which, Confud finally replied with contempt, patronizing behavior, and more insults. Psychologically speaking, extremism angers Confud and Confud will take out his anger on any extremists he sees, because he treats people who disagree with him differently than those who agree with him. Others, like me, treat people based upon how they behave towards others and towards me personally, not based upon what their ideology or beliefs are.

People like Ariel can get Confud to feel guilt, thereby forcing Confud to look inwards and examine his own behavior in order to correct it, but this is only temporary. So long as Ariel avoids the “extremist” positions or advocating those positions in front of Confud, and stays to the safe topics of her own personal behavior and what she expects from polite people, Confud is forced to remove his prejudiced view of extremists.

Passive-aggressive was always an interesting phenomenon, because it was so irrational.

I have no urge to attack people personally because their ideas were different from mine. People may recall steve, which I disagreed wholly concerning many matters of the Iraq War. Steve, (not steve j) however, always kept his calm and his discipline, and did not resort to childish name calling or showing of contempt. I was interested in understanding his position and the reasons for his behavior, thus the reason why I asked probing questions and was aggressive in challenging his positions because otherwise they seemingly did not make much sense to me.

Confud came here asking questions in seemingly good faith, I answered with respect and politeness representing my view of things, but this olive branch was knocked down and stomped in the mud by Confud when he didn’t like the answers. Such is the behavior of mercurial and undisciplined beings. No more need be said.

My impression is that they do feel threatened by what they see as a new world order under Bush and that radicalism will increase amongst the young whilst discrimination and injustice increases. Noone likes being bullied. And there has been a hardening since Iraq. I can feel a distinct chill toward westerners where there wasn’t before.

My impression is that the West is being envaded by a new world order under Islam and that radicalism will increase amongst their young whilst discrimination and injustice increase and the west appeases more and more. Noone likes being bullied. And there has been a hardening since 9/11. I can feel a distinct chill toward suicide bombers where there wasn’t before.

The Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs might beg to differ. But I won’t bother with the link, as I’m certain you wouldn’t trust an Israeli Gov’t link. Fair enough.

Then there is this: “Reuters has provided video of healthy armed men entering ambulance with UN markings for transport. UNRWA initially denied that its ambulances carry militants but later reported that the driver was forced to comply with threats from armed men”

Video available here

Now I’m willing to grant that the UN or the UN ambulance driver were unaware of this/forced at gunpoint to do this, but that doesn’t negate the fact that the terrorists hold no regard what so ever for the sanctity supposedly given ambulances,as is apparent in the video. They don’t even hesitate, which lends credence to the idea that it’s a regular occurance. Once they do violate that sanctity, it is GONE. Their actions hurt many people, but to blame Israel because they are forced to treat ambulances as any other vehicle is absurd, is it not?

Thie issue is akin to blaming the US for deaths of ‘innocents’ in Iraq when terrorists are killed, and others are killed with them. Who is to blame, the US for shooting at a house where a terrorist is shooting at them from, or the terrorist for deliberately fighting from a location where there are innocents? I blame the terrorist.
You?

What strikes me most about muslim communities generally is that they are much the same in their aspirations as anyone else. If anything they value education for their kids more so than most western countries (outside of Northern Europe).

My impression is that they do feel threatened by what they see as a new world order under Bush and that radicalism will increase amongst the young whilst discrimination and injustice increases. Noone likes being bullied. And there has been a hardening since Iraq. I can feel a distinct chill toward westerners where there wasn’t before.

Hard to know where to put the marker of history I agree. When the British and the French carved up the middle East after the Great War? Possibly.

The Israeli/Palestinian mess has always drawn anger and now Iraq is seen as another great western hypocrisy.

Thanks for the well wishes, I’m not off right away though. It’s only half business too. Half is surfing.

I’m from the desert, and before my health failed, I would spend time in it no matter the temperature. Would drive back from sales calls for hours on end at 114 F, on seldom traveled roads with the windows down, no ac, in its stark beauty. “All our lives should be thus fair and distinct. All our lives seek a suitable background.” The Aleutians gave me a similar feeling. But that is neither here nor there.

I believe this has been a long time brewing. Starting long before the Muslim Brotherhood and its offshoots, or the League of Nations mandate. It’s easy to say “root causes” but hard to identify them and even harder to deal with them. Is it religious, economic, political structures? Colonialism? Cultural? All of that seems to be very “Eurocentric” interpretations. Do religious fanatics need a reason or a root cause as we would see it? Since whatever they believe is the unassailable, irrefutable truth, anything we do can give them a reason. Again I refer to Hoffer’s “True Believer”.

Since you work in the Islamic world, you’ll develop a bias (that is meant in a neutral way) based on who you deal with and your experiences, and your prejudices going in. I’ve talked to others who have spent years in Islamic countries and found them horrible. muslim friends in college, Iranian Shia, and did find them prickly and medieval in their attitudes about women. They were secular, or at least they didn’t follow the dietary laws regarding hops.

If you haven’t seen it, watch Kurosawa’s “Rashamon”. The truth is usually somewhere in the middle.

And remember, this is Neo-neocon’s home, the rest of us are just guests at her pleasure, and the rules of hospitality cut both ways.

God, I can be preachy. See, self-deprecation.

Good luck in your business trip.

Couldn’t let this one go past. There is a standing joke about yanks and irony all over the english speaking world.

It isn’t complimentary though.

I’m damn angry about all this. I really am. And it makes me angry when I hear the chickenhawks belittling the impact on the rest of the world.

My kids will never get to visit half the places I’ve been because many of those places are just too dangerous and getting worse.

Instead of working on root causes we’ve thrown petrol on the fire of radical islam.

I believe history will show the Iraq adventure to be the greatest con of all time. I really do.

Anyways the little kiddies on here will have to find another hate figure soon enough. I’m off to a hotbed of islam shortly. Work to do.

BTW Aussies may take the p… out of you constantly, to get respect you have to give it back. Once you do, you’ll find us quite nice really.

We are very antiauthoritarian though. Must be the Irish in us.

I realize how some of these people react
regarding the war. That was kind of Neo-neocon’s point, and our left here are really nasty about this, and you will lose a friend if you disagree. So there is a sensitivity and an overreaction. Know too, that many of these people have been coming here for quite awhile, and so believe it to be their place. And would view you, rightly or wrongly, as the poorly mannered guest.

I do not use the term “troll” unless someone really works hard at it. I don’t believe that you have done that. But you have been snarky, as they say.

No, digs do not play well with us. Self-deprecation does, recognizing the irony in life does, many other forms, but not that. Of course, nothing applies to all of us here, just as in Australia.

Regarding extremism, there’s an old joke about the American Communist who was asked what he thought of left-wing extremists. Said he’s never met any, all the extremists are on the right.

The old John Birchers here, who saw a communist in every pot, left me with only one thing of worth. The spectrum is anarchist on one end and totalitarian on the other. The rest of us fall in between. We can come to agreements and compromise, anarchists and totalitarians can’t and won’t. Read Hoffer’s “True Believer”.

Personally, I’m a classic liberal of the American type. Which is why I can like John F. Kennedy and R. Reagan at the same time.
If it were possible, I would love to believe that before my children die, there will be no more dictatorships, no more theocracies, no juntas, nor oligarchies. Just modern secular democracies that will bicker but never go to war. It’ll never happen…

If I say as an example I am opposed to the invasion of Iraq, automatically the sillier posters on here take that as being a Saddam supporter and you have to go through the whole gamut of childish unproductive inanity to get past that to the point where you started from. By then the other side has dropped its bundle and huffed off in a sulk because they can’t conceive any argument that isn’t black v white, us v them etc.

I find that tiring. It’s easier to scratch the surface at the start, sort out the lightweights and chaff from those of more substance.

It is a bit of perverse fun to take the pi.. out of the wasps, the nyos and the yfronts of this board though

Further, if you know anything about Australians you’ll know that we are a pretty straightforward people who enjoy a bit of hurly burly and having a few digs. It is an integral part of our humour. It often doesn’t play well with you yanks but c’est la vie.

I’m certainly struggling to comprehend the neocon phenomenon. i’ve never had much time for extremism.

Have you noticed that you can’t seem to post anything without saying something nasty about someone. Is this what your filled with? Man, I hope you don’t do this around your children.

Like I said, its not your beliefs, its how you express yourself.

I read the “Australian” everyday, but having been the direct recepient of a lying, deceitful journalist’s bulls*** article, I take it all as inherently distorted to some degree.

Good policy. As do I. Most of my working life I’ve been involved in things that required reading between the lines, so to speak. I’ve also been slagged by a lazy journalist. It was a profitable exercise in the end though for me.

The Australian is a Murdoch rag, so I wouldn’t take too much notice anyway. It is interesting to compare it to the ultra rightist garbage that uncle deeppockets puts out in the USA though. He knows his market.

Personall I’d string the bas…. up.

Having just reread the thread, I have mixed you and Jen up, so…….sorry.

Confud, you are a pathetic, contemptible waste of skin. ‘Nuff said. I’m sure you’ll love this one, but from now on, I will not respond to your comments, thereby saving everybody else on this blog the pain of reading your responses to mine.

9:24 PM, June 04, 2006

As much as I loathed Queen…..

…….and another one bites the dust.

Thanks for playing.

Hey, there’s some good stuff there. Maybe I missed my calling.

anonymess said

The