Comments on: And as the sun slowly sets on the British Navy: the concept of honor http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/ Thu, 08 Jan 2009 01:59:53 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1 By: Ymarsakar http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33495 Ymarsakar Wed, 11 Apr 2007 20:58:45 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33495 If it does rise again, it'll rise over Japan and Australia, not Britain. If it does rise again, it’ll rise over Japan and Australia, not Britain.

]]> By: colagirl http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33499 colagirl Wed, 11 Apr 2007 22:04:49 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33499 As someone who feels a great degree of gratitude for the assistance the British have lent to us, I find this whole episode extremely depressing. I wish their countrymen had better represented them. And I worry about what this foretells for the West. *Sigh.* I hope the Royal Navy can rebuild and fix this situation. I don't know what else to say. It's hard for me to put my feelings about this incident into words. As someone who feels a great degree of gratitude for the assistance the British have lent to us, I find this whole episode extremely depressing. I wish their countrymen had better represented them. And I worry about what this foretells for the West. *Sigh.* I hope the Royal Navy can rebuild and fix this situation.

I don’t know what else to say. It’s hard for me to put my feelings about this incident into words.

]]> By: expat http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33500 expat Wed, 11 Apr 2007 22:42:51 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33500 Probably the most succinct treatment of this topic is found in To Kill a Mockingbird in the rabid dog episode. At the end, Jem says, "Atticus is a gentleman and I am too." Probably the most succinct treatment of this topic is found in To Kill a Mockingbird in the rabid dog episode. At the end, Jem says, “Atticus is a gentleman and I am too.”

]]> By: Lee http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33505 Lee Thu, 12 Apr 2007 00:26:59 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33505 The British have always been a strange "dichotomy" when it comes to warfare. While being able to "commit atrocities" and conduct "piracy and privateering" with the best, they still manage to be the ones to conduct warfare under a sense of "fair play"(wouldn't be "sporting" otherwise). I recall Churchill didn't want sub-machineguns issued to the army, being seen as "gangster" weapons not suited for a "civilized army", until schmeissers were used with such devestating effects upon them. And even then, their Sten guns were only issued to Commando, Airborne, and other Special Forces since they were expected to use a modicum of "dirty pool" in their tactics. Never count them out, though. The British seem to have a penchant for "losing every battle, but still winning the war". The British have always been a strange “dichotomy” when it comes to warfare. While being able to “commit atrocities” and conduct “piracy and privateering” with the best, they still manage to be the ones to conduct warfare under a sense of “fair play”(wouldn’t be “sporting” otherwise). I recall Churchill didn’t want sub-machineguns issued to the army, being seen as “gangster” weapons not suited for a “civilized army”, until schmeissers were used with such devestating effects upon them. And even then, their Sten guns were only issued to Commando, Airborne, and other Special Forces since they were expected to use a modicum of “dirty pool” in their tactics.
Never count them out, though. The British seem to have a penchant for “losing every battle, but still winning the war”.

]]> By: camojack http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33521 camojack Thu, 12 Apr 2007 07:54:14 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33521 Now it's <i>Not So</i> Great Britain... Now it’s Not So Great Britain…

]]> By: Roy E http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33526 Roy E Thu, 12 Apr 2007 12:09:07 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33526 It's not just Britain's problem. This incident is representative of the leftist rot at the core of Western Civilization. Britain is just a bit more advanced in its rot than are America and Australia. We are only beginning to harvest the seeds of planted in our educational system decades ago. It may very well get worse before it gets better. It’s not just Britain’s problem.

This incident is representative of the leftist rot at the core of Western Civilization. Britain is just a bit more advanced in its rot than are America and Australia. We are only beginning to harvest the seeds of planted in our educational system decades ago. It may very well get worse before it gets better.

]]> By: Edmund Jenks (MAXINE) http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33539 Edmund Jenks (MAXINE) Thu, 12 Apr 2007 15:07:59 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33539 Soon after the press conference with the British Military was broadcast, Col. Jack Jacobs, Military analyst – MSNBC had at the ready, this quote from English philosopher John Stuart Mill who wrote extensively about theories of liberty. On the duty of the military to any country, Mr. Mill wrote: "War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse. The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." With that, Col. Jack Jacobs concluded his thoughts and comments about the recent acts of the British Military in Iran. 'Nuff said! Soon after the press conference with the British Military was broadcast, Col. Jack Jacobs, Military analyst – MSNBC had at the ready, this quote from English philosopher John Stuart Mill who wrote extensively about theories of liberty. On the duty of the military to any country, Mr. Mill wrote:

“War is an ugly thing, but not the ugliest of things. The decayed and degraded state of moral and patriotic feeling which thinks that nothing is worth war is much worse.

The person who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself.”

With that, Col. Jack Jacobs concluded his thoughts and comments about the recent acts of the British Military in Iran.

‘Nuff said!

]]> By: Ymarsakar http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33547 Ymarsakar Thu, 12 Apr 2007 18:32:20 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33547 <b># camojack Says: April 12th, 2007 at 2:54 am Now it’s Not So Great Britain… </b> It is the Brits. For Brittle. # camojack Says:
April 12th, 2007 at 2:54 am

Now it’s Not So Great Britain…

It is the Brits. For Brittle.

]]> By: Daniel in Brookline http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33548 Daniel in Brookline Thu, 12 Apr 2007 18:33:33 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33548 Good thoughts! I agree, Roy, that it's not just Britain's problem. If we're lucky, Britain's military allies -- America, Australia, and so on -- will take this as a warning and a wake-up call. But it may take more than that. It may take a <i>positive</i> example, in terms of seeing how a Western hostage is <i>expected</i> to act. In this, we may be lucky: the American presidential campaign season is well underway, and John McCain is a major contender. I have a feeling his captivity in Vietnam will be discussed at great length over the next several months. (Note: McCain isn't at the top of my list, by any means. But when it comes to enduring captivity with honor, the man has a story to tell, and we very much need to hear it.) Edmund: thanks for quoting JSM -- I like that quote very much. It reminds me of something I saw online a few years ago and never forgot: <i>"War is hell. War <b>should</b> be hell. It's what makes it a thing to be avoided. But sometimes the alternative to war is worse than hell. And so we must fight."</i> respectfully, Daniel in Brookline Good thoughts!

I agree, Roy, that it’s not just Britain’s problem. If we’re lucky, Britain’s military allies — America, Australia, and so on — will take this as a warning and a wake-up call.

But it may take more than that. It may take a positive example, in terms of seeing how a Western hostage is expected to act. In this, we may be lucky: the American presidential campaign season is well underway, and John McCain is a major contender. I have a feeling his captivity in Vietnam will be discussed at great length over the next several months.

(Note: McCain isn’t at the top of my list, by any means. But when it comes to enduring captivity with honor, the man has a story to tell, and we very much need to hear it.)

Edmund: thanks for quoting JSM — I like that quote very much. It reminds me of something I saw online a few years ago and never forgot:

“War is hell. War should be hell. It’s what makes it a thing to be avoided. But sometimes the alternative to war is worse than hell. And so we must fight.”

respectfully,
Daniel in Brookline

]]> By: Daniel in Brookline http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33550 Daniel in Brookline Thu, 12 Apr 2007 18:53:22 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2007/04/11/and-as-the-sun-slowly-sets-on-the-british-navy-the-concept-of-honor/#comment-33550 michaelyon-online.comBy the bye, some Brits take their military responsibilities more seriously than others, it seems. <a href="http://www.michaelyon-online.com/wp/british-forces-at-war-as-witnessed-by-an-american.htm" rel="nofollow">Michael Yon</a> has quite a bit to say about that. respectfully, Daniel in Brookline michaelyon-online.comBy the bye, some Brits take their military responsibilities more seriously than others, it seems. Michael Yon has quite a bit to say about that.

respectfully,
Daniel in Brookline

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