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	<title>Comments on: Osama gives a history lesson</title>
	<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/</link>
	<description></description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 00:28:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: polprof</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41721</link>
		<author>polprof</author>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Sep 2007 19:57:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41721</guid>
					<description>Thanks for noting this aspect of OBL's speech.  Administration and MSM comments highlighting supposed "rambling" show that they are missing a chance to understand the character of what we are up against here: what OBL's people understand about us, and what they do not.  The speech sounds, and is, strange, but I'm sure every word was carefully calculated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for noting this aspect of OBL&#8217;s speech.  Administration and MSM comments highlighting supposed &#8220;rambling&#8221; show that they are missing a chance to understand the character of what we are up against here: what OBL&#8217;s people understand about us, and what they do not.  The speech sounds, and is, strange, but I&#8217;m sure every word was carefully calculated.</p>
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		<title>By: Fat Man</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41726</link>
		<author>Fat Man</author>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Sep 2007 21:48:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41726</guid>
					<description>'I think his present ones might be mixing up their Kennedys, mistaking Bobby’s 1968 antiwar Presidential campaign for JFK’s 1960 one."

Actually, one of the loopier, but popular, JFK assassination conspiracy theories was that JFK had decided to pull out of Vietnam in late 1963, and that LBJ and the CIA had him assassinated to stop the pull out. Truthers had nothing on JFK assassination conspiracy loons.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;I think his present ones might be mixing up their Kennedys, mistaking Bobby’s 1968 antiwar Presidential campaign for JFK’s 1960 one.&#8221;</p>
<p>Actually, one of the loopier, but popular, JFK assassination conspiracy theories was that JFK had decided to pull out of Vietnam in late 1963, and that LBJ and the CIA had him assassinated to stop the pull out. Truthers had nothing on JFK assassination conspiracy loons.</p>
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		<title>By: Cappy</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41727</link>
		<author>Cappy</author>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Sep 2007 21:54:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41727</guid>
					<description>In the case of The Cause (tm), it's more like competing ninnies.

Also, L'Shana Tova to you.  Have a good New Year and keep writing!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the case of The Cause &#8482;, it&#8217;s more like competing ninnies.</p>
<p>Also, L&#8217;Shana Tova to you.  Have a good New Year and keep writing!</p>
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		<title>By: Talkinkamel</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41728</link>
		<author>Talkinkamel</author>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 Sep 2007 22:02:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41728</guid>
					<description>Has anyone considered that maybe, this speech was actually written by an American traitor?  Adam Gadahn, for instance?

The knowledge of American politics, and the references, sound more like an American, not like ol' binny who was apparently more worried about the "tragedy" of Al-Andalus, and getting American soldiers off sacred Saudi soil.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has anyone considered that maybe, this speech was actually written by an American traitor?  Adam Gadahn, for instance?</p>
<p>The knowledge of American politics, and the references, sound more like an American, not like ol&#8217; binny who was apparently more worried about the &#8220;tragedy&#8221; of Al-Andalus, and getting American soldiers off sacred Saudi soil.</p>
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		<title>By: DC</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41734</link>
		<author>DC</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 00:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41734</guid>
					<description>Even educated people commonly believed that Kennedy was killed by the CIA because he  was too dovish on Vietnam.  There’s even a Youtube clip showing that secret service people didn’t get onto the back of Kennedy’s car to protect him because they knew what was going to happen.  (There are special platforms for them with handles for them to hold onto). 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8

The identification of Rumsfeld may simply be a confusion of him with McNamara who many wouldn’t remember, so Rumsfeld’s name is used.  Rumsfeld became Ford’s Secretary of Defense and Ford figures in the conspiracy theory, he was the last surviving member of the Warren commission and altered a document in the report.

http://www.jfklancer.com/Ford-Rankin.html

Bin Laden does go on to say that picking Rumsfeld was “incredible”.  So it’s clear that his history is mistaken or deliberately wrong.  It’s clear that his point is to appeal to the world view that was promoted back in the sixties depicting the war a consequence of a conspiracy just as is being done today. (Gulf of Tonkin Incident then, forged uranium sale document and trutherism today)  

The frequent mention of corporations is to appeal to those who think of themselves as above believing in conspiracy theory.  It’s not a conspiracy per se they reason, just a matter of overwhelming influence in the hands of the powerful few. 

 It does appear that the will of the people is thwarted, especially when dubious polling techniques are used to promote various notions.  The complex nature of what people want is simplified and manipulated to paint a false picture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Even educated people commonly believed that Kennedy was killed by the CIA because he  was too dovish on Vietnam.  There’s even a Youtube clip showing that secret service people didn’t get onto the back of Kennedy’s car to protect him because they knew what was going to happen.  (There are special platforms for them with handles for them to hold onto). </p>
<p><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY02Qkuc_f8</a></p>
<p>The identification of Rumsfeld may simply be a confusion of him with McNamara who many wouldn’t remember, so Rumsfeld’s name is used.  Rumsfeld became Ford’s Secretary of Defense and Ford figures in the conspiracy theory, he was the last surviving member of the Warren commission and altered a document in the report.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.jfklancer.com/Ford-Rankin.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.jfklancer.com/Ford-Rankin.html</a></p>
<p>Bin Laden does go on to say that picking Rumsfeld was “incredible”.  So it’s clear that his history is mistaken or deliberately wrong.  It’s clear that his point is to appeal to the world view that was promoted back in the sixties depicting the war a consequence of a conspiracy just as is being done today. (Gulf of Tonkin Incident then, forged uranium sale document and trutherism today)  </p>
<p>The frequent mention of corporations is to appeal to those who think of themselves as above believing in conspiracy theory.  It’s not a conspiracy per se they reason, just a matter of overwhelming influence in the hands of the powerful few. </p>
<p> It does appear that the will of the people is thwarted, especially when dubious polling techniques are used to promote various notions.  The complex nature of what people want is simplified and manipulated to paint a false picture.</p>
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		<title>By: neo-neocon</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41737</link>
		<author>neo-neocon</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 00:32:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41737</guid>
					<description>DC: that's interesting about Rumsfeld and McNamara.   Funny, I always thought they resembled each other a bit---the wire-rim glasses and the slicked-back hairdo.  Maybe to Osama, all white-businessmen-who-later-became-Defense-Secretary look alike.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DC: that&#8217;s interesting about Rumsfeld and McNamara.   Funny, I always thought they resembled each other a bit&#8212;the wire-rim glasses and the slicked-back hairdo.  Maybe to Osama, all white-businessmen-who-later-became-Defense-Secretary look alike.</p>
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		<title>By: Trimegistus</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41744</link>
		<author>Trimegistus</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 01:36:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41744</guid>
					<description>It's comforting to think that Osama (or whoever) is feeding American liberals a bunch of bull that will appeal to them, but there's also the possibility that the Islamists really believe all that stuff themselves.  These are people who take the Protocols of the Elders of Zion seriously.  To them, everything is a conspiracy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s comforting to think that Osama (or whoever) is feeding American liberals a bunch of bull that will appeal to them, but there&#8217;s also the possibility that the Islamists really believe all that stuff themselves.  These are people who take the Protocols of the Elders of Zion seriously.  To them, everything is a conspiracy.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark H.</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41748</link>
		<author>Mark H.</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 02:50:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41748</guid>
					<description>"...but there’s also the possibility that the Islamists really believe all that stuff themselves."

I don't think it's just a possibility Trimegistus. After all, if so many Americans believe that stuff even though they should know better, simply by virtue of living here; there's no reaon to doubt the Islamo-Fascists would believe it absent any first-hand knowledge of our country/culture.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8230;but there’s also the possibility that the Islamists really believe all that stuff themselves.&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s just a possibility Trimegistus. After all, if so many Americans believe that stuff even though they should know better, simply by virtue of living here; there&#8217;s no reaon to doubt the Islamo-Fascists would believe it absent any first-hand knowledge of our country/culture.</p>
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		<title>By: DC</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41750</link>
		<author>DC</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 03:17:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41750</guid>
					<description>Neo says:

“they [Rumsfeld and McNamara] resembled each other a bit—the wire-rim glasses and the slicked-back hairdo.
Maybe to Osama, all white-businessmen-who-later-became-Defense-Secretary look alike.”  

More on Rumsfeld McNamara similarity--

McNamara was one of the Whiz kids, these were veterans who went to work as executives for Ford Motors,.

about the Whiz Kids, Wiki says:

“The group was part of a management science operation within the Army Air Force known as Statistical Control, organized to coordinate all the operational and logistical information required to manage the waging of war.”

also

“they have been criticized for starting the trend of managing by numbers and building corporate bureaucracies, making Top Management a closed environment surrounded with an elitist staff ignorant of the realities of operations and markets, who have only known them by the books or by reports.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiz_Kids

Rumsfeld was Gerald Ford’s Secretary of Defense.  Although Gerald Ford was from Michigan, the home of Ford motors, his name wasn’t really Ford, he changed his name.

 Wiki has an article on conspiracy theory.  It goes into its role in history and the psychology of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory#General_arguments_against_conspiracism</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Neo says:</p>
<p>“they [Rumsfeld and McNamara] resembled each other a bit—the wire-rim glasses and the slicked-back hairdo.<br />
Maybe to Osama, all white-businessmen-who-later-became-Defense-Secretary look alike.”  </p>
<p>More on Rumsfeld McNamara similarity&#8211;</p>
<p>McNamara was one of the Whiz kids, these were veterans who went to work as executives for Ford Motors,.</p>
<p>about the Whiz Kids, Wiki says:</p>
<p>“The group was part of a management science operation within the Army Air Force known as Statistical Control, organized to coordinate all the operational and logistical information required to manage the waging of war.”</p>
<p>also</p>
<p>“they have been criticized for starting the trend of managing by numbers and building corporate bureaucracies, making Top Management a closed environment surrounded with an elitist staff ignorant of the realities of operations and markets, who have only known them by the books or by reports.”</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiz_Kids" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiz_Kids</a></p>
<p>Rumsfeld was Gerald Ford’s Secretary of Defense.  Although Gerald Ford was from Michigan, the home of Ford motors, his name wasn’t really Ford, he changed his name.</p>
<p> Wiki has an article on conspiracy theory.  It goes into its role in history and the psychology of it.</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory#General_arguments_against_conspiracism" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conspiracy_theory#General_arguments_against_conspiracism</a></p>
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		<title>By: Kevin</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41754</link>
		<author>Kevin</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 05:18:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41754</guid>
					<description>heh, I bet Osama would outscore my 21-year-old niece on the US History CLEP test!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>heh, I bet Osama would outscore my 21-year-old niece on the US History CLEP test!</p>
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		<title>By: Jim</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41785</link>
		<author>Jim</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:39:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41785</guid>
					<description>I agree, Neo.  No one could ever be quite so ignorant as to believe that is the history.  And, I imagine, no one would expect Osama to be savy about such things.  So why bring it up?  You simplify your opponents.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree, Neo.  No one could ever be quite so ignorant as to believe that is the history.  And, I imagine, no one would expect Osama to be savy about such things.  So why bring it up?  You simplify your opponents.</p>
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		<title>By: Donald Wolberg</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41795</link>
		<author>Donald Wolberg</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 13:57:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41795</guid>
					<description>Correct history or mythology matters little to the dead of 9/11 and all the others killed or maimed by these evil people. They need to be found and rendered harmless and then we can have all those political science grad students looking at the words and writing theses, but first matters first. It is one of the amazing failures of Clinton et al and later Bush et al, that leaves these deadly loonies hanging around their caves or otherwise.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correct history or mythology matters little to the dead of 9/11 and all the others killed or maimed by these evil people. They need to be found and rendered harmless and then we can have all those political science grad students looking at the words and writing theses, but first matters first. It is one of the amazing failures of Clinton et al and later Bush et al, that leaves these deadly loonies hanging around their caves or otherwise.</p>
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		<title>By: sergey</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41798</link>
		<author>sergey</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 15:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41798</guid>
					<description>Osama himself is not a big problem to wary about, but ideology he expounded is. In every radical mosque the same ideas are repeated in daily basis, in every European capital city and in many US cities too. When the West will surmount enough political will to put an end to this outrage?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Osama himself is not a big problem to wary about, but ideology he expounded is. In every radical mosque the same ideas are repeated in daily basis, in every European capital city and in many US cities too. When the West will surmount enough political will to put an end to this outrage?</p>
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		<title>By: DC</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41799</link>
		<author>DC</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 16:04:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41799</guid>
					<description>Why we are dependent of foreign oil:

This was explained to me in all seriousness by a fifty-five year old massage therapist.  It’s because of the widespread use of the auto and there was a conspiracy that resulted in this widespread desire for autos.  People used to ride nice clean electric trolleys, but they were replaced with dirty buses by a conspiracy of oil and auto companies.

You can read about it here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_streetcar_conspiracy

http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_335.html

Arguing with him was futile.   Of course I would never mention the name Rumsfeld to him, he would take that as a signal to rant about the war and from there it would be tales of germ warfare against the Indians and so on from which there would be no escape until he was done.   

Sometimes these massage therapy sessions were like entering a Twilight Zone portal into my childhood,  life turned into a recurring bad dream with intermittent periods of waking up only to be pulled back in over and over until time was up.  He did play the right sort of music to set a relaxing mood though, at least he got that right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why we are dependent of foreign oil:</p>
<p>This was explained to me in all seriousness by a fifty-five year old massage therapist.  It’s because of the widespread use of the auto and there was a conspiracy that resulted in this widespread desire for autos.  People used to ride nice clean electric trolleys, but they were replaced with dirty buses by a conspiracy of oil and auto companies.</p>
<p>You can read about it here:</p>
<p><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_streetcar_conspiracy" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_streetcar_conspiracy</a></p>
<p><a href="http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_335.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a2_335.html</a></p>
<p>Arguing with him was futile.   Of course I would never mention the name Rumsfeld to him, he would take that as a signal to rant about the war and from there it would be tales of germ warfare against the Indians and so on from which there would be no escape until he was done.   </p>
<p>Sometimes these massage therapy sessions were like entering a Twilight Zone portal into my childhood,  life turned into a recurring bad dream with intermittent periods of waking up only to be pulled back in over and over until time was up.  He did play the right sort of music to set a relaxing mood though, at least he got that right.</p>
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		<title>By: Lee</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41810</link>
		<author>Lee</author>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Sep 2007 19:41:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41810</guid>
					<description>Of course, if his comments are any indicator, correct history seems to matter little to Donald, as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course, if his comments are any indicator, correct history seems to matter little to Donald, as well.</p>
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		<title>By: mary</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41855</link>
		<author>mary</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 13:19:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41855</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;Has anyone considered that maybe, this speech was actually written by an American traitor? Adam Gadahn, for instance?&lt;/i&gt;

I think it could have been. Either that, or Osama has been living in a basement in Falls Church, Virginia reading Daily Kos and antiwar.com.

The most interesting thing about this speech is the press' reaction. For whatever reason, the speech obviously focused on the American left. The press is embarrased by the references to Lefty heroes like Chomsky and Scheuer, they're disappointed by the lack of real blood, threats and fear in the text and his beard looks funny. With this tape, Osama is losing his friends in the press. Even &lt;a href="http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/offbeat/2007/09/10/moos.osama.beard.affil" rel="nofollow"&gt;CNN&lt;/a&gt; is making fun of him.

Effective media relations are essential to any terrorist organization. Osama (or Osama the brand) jumped the shark with this one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Has anyone considered that maybe, this speech was actually written by an American traitor? Adam Gadahn, for instance?</i></p>
<p>I think it could have been. Either that, or Osama has been living in a basement in Falls Church, Virginia reading Daily Kos and antiwar.com.</p>
<p>The most interesting thing about this speech is the press&#8217; reaction. For whatever reason, the speech obviously focused on the American left. The press is embarrased by the references to Lefty heroes like Chomsky and Scheuer, they&#8217;re disappointed by the lack of real blood, threats and fear in the text and his beard looks funny. With this tape, Osama is losing his friends in the press. Even <a href="http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/offbeat/2007/09/10/moos.osama.beard.affil" rel="nofollow">CNN</a> is making fun of him.</p>
<p>Effective media relations are essential to any terrorist organization. Osama (or Osama the brand) jumped the shark with this one.</p>
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		<title>By: Talkinkamel</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41858</link>
		<author>Talkinkamel</author>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Sep 2007 14:29:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-41858</guid>
					<description>mary

Yes, I agree, Osama's jumped the shark!  (I'd love to see his face photoshopped on the body of the Fonz, in that infamous shark-jumping episode.)

Alive and unconquered, Osama would have been a hero.  Dead, he would have been a martyr.  Maybe this is the best way to deal with him; alive, but as a feeble clown with an obviously dyed beard, begging the American Left for help and mouthing speeches written for him by a pudgy Southern California ex-hippy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>mary</p>
<p>Yes, I agree, Osama&#8217;s jumped the shark!  (I&#8217;d love to see his face photoshopped on the body of the Fonz, in that infamous shark-jumping episode.)</p>
<p>Alive and unconquered, Osama would have been a hero.  Dead, he would have been a martyr.  Maybe this is the best way to deal with him; alive, but as a feeble clown with an obviously dyed beard, begging the American Left for help and mouthing speeches written for him by a pudgy Southern California ex-hippy.</p>
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		<title>By: Sofia Vergara</title>
		<link>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-49539</link>
		<author>Sofia Vergara</author>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Dec 2007 09:16:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://neoneocon.com/2007/09/09/osama-gives-a-history-lesson/#comment-49539</guid>
					<description>Hi there...Man i love reading your blog, interesting posts ! it was a great Thursday . &lt;a&gt;Sofia Vergara&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi there&#8230;Man i love reading your blog, interesting posts ! it was a great Thursday . <a>Sofia Vergara</a></p>
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