Comments on: Palin and Pygmalion: who said class is dead in America? http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/ Fri, 10 Feb 2012 03:30:18 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1.3 By: Gunfighter http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-94855 Gunfighter Tue, 02 Dec 2008 11:56:31 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-94855 Since when has America been a classless society? Our society has never, ever been classless, it has, however, always been class-permeable. Class permeability is the real thing that sets us apart from other nations. Since when has America been a classless society? Our society has never, ever been classless, it has, however, always been class-permeable. Class permeability is the real thing that sets us apart from other nations.

]]> By: nyomythus http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90168 nyomythus Mon, 27 Oct 2008 02:46:58 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90168 People can be as religious as they wish, I love this about my country, some of them I may love and some I may dislike or even hate, I just would rather they not govern me because I think whether they wish it or not it effects their decisions, and not always for the best (imagine a first lady conjuring the wisdom of the stars for guidance), the authority of faith and the authority of reason are in conflict, i'ld rather have at least someone more deeply grounded in reason than faith. People can be as religious as they wish, I love this about my country, some of them I may love and some I may dislike or even hate, I just would rather they not govern me because I think whether they wish it or not it effects their decisions, and not always for the best (imagine a first lady conjuring the wisdom of the stars for guidance), the authority of faith and the authority of reason are in conflict, i’ld rather have at least someone more deeply grounded in reason than faith.

]]> By: nyomythus http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90167 nyomythus Mon, 27 Oct 2008 02:40:19 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90167 There is long host of Catholic forces allied with fascism in the 1930, 40's; Spanish Catholic right wing, Father Tiso in Slovakia, Father Coughlin in the USA, Tito in Croatia, and the fact that religion had no decent on fascism as the Vatican has had no decent of the war against our contemporary conflicts with jihadic imperialism, but this is way off the point, their capitulation and cowardice has swayed the balance of the world into horror and chaos then and now. (the Rohaan that never arrived on Pelennor Fields, the von Blücher than never arrived at Waterloo, I can't think of another analogy at the moment) Palin is benign in comparison to where this topic has turned, yet she finds that it's only interesting to visit a library to see what book the rest of us should not be looking at; there are criticisms to make of her, like there are criticisms for Obama, Biden, and McCain -- the question is how does it all weigh up? Well, it doesn't weigh to well for me on the Republican ticket this year, and I find some comfort that Obama has been evolving towards the neocon/classical liberal position on reigning in Pakistan in what is now evidently an expansionist war, via Taliban proxies, to occupy Afghanistan; Pakistan has been the source of our global jihadic troubles more than the main stream public has known about, and they need to no we ain't playing that shit. Whether he likes it or nothing he will have to make yay or nay decision on real international issues, some of which gravely effect America and western liberalism as a whole, I think he'll be capable of throwing a hard defensive punch, if it comes to it the hawks must stand by his side. There is long host of Catholic forces allied with fascism in the 1930, 40′s; Spanish Catholic right wing, Father Tiso in Slovakia, Father Coughlin in the USA, Tito in Croatia, and the fact that religion had no decent on fascism as the Vatican has had no decent of the war against our contemporary conflicts with jihadic imperialism, but this is way off the point, their capitulation and cowardice has swayed the balance of the world into horror and chaos then and now. (the Rohaan that never arrived on Pelennor Fields, the von Blücher than never arrived at Waterloo, I can’t think of another analogy at the moment)

Palin is benign in comparison to where this topic has turned, yet she finds that it’s only interesting to visit a library to see what book the rest of us should not be looking at; there are criticisms to make of her, like there are criticisms for Obama, Biden, and McCain — the question is how does it all weigh up?

Well, it doesn’t weigh to well for me on the Republican ticket this year, and I find some comfort that Obama has been evolving towards the neocon/classical liberal position on reigning in Pakistan in what is now evidently an expansionist war, via Taliban proxies, to occupy Afghanistan; Pakistan has been the source of our global jihadic troubles more than the main stream public has known about, and they need to no we ain’t playing that shit. Whether he likes it or nothing he will have to make yay or nay decision on real international issues, some of which gravely effect America and western liberalism as a whole, I think he’ll be capable of throwing a hard defensive punch, if it comes to it the hawks must stand by his side.

]]> By: Vince P http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90165 Vince P Mon, 27 Oct 2008 02:30:13 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90165 And also, nyo does a thing that is very common nowadays on the Left and that is to state that the Government is the Nation. So when someone says America is/was a Christian nation, they immediately spring into action stating that really all the founders where deceptive atheists who was just saying things for the hell of saying and that the biggest heathen of all, Jefferson, was against all religion. Newsflash: America was never defined as being the Government. America was its people. The Govt was to be secular so as to protect both religion and government from the corruption of the other. That is what Jefferson talked about. Keeping things in their proper place. He was not advocating for a populace free from the self-restraint of faith in the God of the Bible. And also, nyo does a thing that is very common nowadays on the Left and that is to state that the Government is the Nation.

So when someone says America is/was a Christian nation, they immediately spring into action stating that really all the founders where deceptive atheists who was just saying things for the hell of saying and that the biggest heathen of all, Jefferson, was against all religion.

Newsflash: America was never defined as being the Government. America was its people. The Govt was to be secular so as to protect both religion and government from the corruption of the other.

That is what Jefferson talked about. Keeping things in their proper place. He was not advocating for a populace free from the self-restraint of faith in the God of the Bible.

]]> By: Vince P http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90163 Vince P Mon, 27 Oct 2008 02:01:43 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90163 It's Obama and his nonsense about collective salvation that mixes Religion and Politics.. because to those on the loonyLeft the State and its power is religion. It’s Obama and his nonsense about collective salvation that mixes Religion and Politics.. because to those on the loonyLeft the State and its power is religion.

]]> By: neo-neocon http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90161 neo-neocon Mon, 27 Oct 2008 01:53:04 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90161 nyomythus: I agree that religion prepared them for it, particularly Luther. But why focus on the role of religion? My point is that religion is used for both good and ill. The Nazis would and could have done their work without religion. There was no "allegiance" between Catholicism and Nazism. Many priests and nuns went to the camps for their attempts to counter Nazism. Yes, the Pope didn't speak out against the genocide. In my opinion that was a grievous error and deep moral failing (<a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/ben_macintyre/article4995103.ece" rel="nofollow">he had his excuses</a>, however; he said it was to protect Catholics and the Church from retribution). But he certainly wasn't a Nazi, or <i>allied</i> with what they did. Sarah Palin has never mixed religion with her post as governor. She is careful to make it clear that her personal beliefs are just that, personal beliefs, and that she is not trying to make them into law. nyomythus: I agree that religion prepared them for it, particularly Luther. But why focus on the role of religion? My point is that religion is used for both good and ill. The Nazis would and could have done their work without religion.

There was no “allegiance” between Catholicism and Nazism. Many priests and nuns went to the camps for their attempts to counter Nazism. Yes, the Pope didn’t speak out against the genocide. In my opinion that was a grievous error and deep moral failing (he had his excuses, however; he said it was to protect Catholics and the Church from retribution). But he certainly wasn’t a Nazi, or allied with what they did.

Sarah Palin has never mixed religion with her post as governor. She is careful to make it clear that her personal beliefs are just that, personal beliefs, and that she is not trying to make them into law.

]]> By: nyomythus http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90160 nyomythus Mon, 27 Oct 2008 01:41:22 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90160 We all yearn for the spiritual and the transcendental (the numinous), or else we wouldn't be human, or rather 'normal' and I love and cherish these feelings and experience like everyone else , and I would never support any notion to outlaw religion, people should make up their own minds about it, I'm stating my lack of confidence for a VP pick (who appeals the the credulity of religion and the worst of the Right) by an elderly presidential candidate (note this argument goes for Obama too, a man who smoked for many years, whose parents died young, whose own VP pick has had life threatening illnesses (I think two stokes), and if both died would leave the presidency to they equally untakeable Nancy Pelosi) I didn't say the Nazi's used the bible, I said the German people were prepared for routing out and genocide of the Jews because religion had prepared them for it, and gave them the notion of totalitarianism; and there was an allegiance between Catholicism and Nazism, repeating myself is tiring, so I'm sure I will stop soon. We all yearn for the spiritual and the transcendental (the numinous), or else we wouldn’t be human, or rather ‘normal’ and I love and cherish these feelings and experience like everyone else , and I would never support any notion to outlaw religion, people should make up their own minds about it, I’m stating my lack of confidence for a VP pick (who appeals the the credulity of religion and the worst of the Right) by an elderly presidential candidate (note this argument goes for Obama too, a man who smoked for many years, whose parents died young, whose own VP pick has had life threatening illnesses (I think two stokes), and if both died would leave the presidency to they equally untakeable Nancy Pelosi)

I didn’t say the Nazi’s used the bible, I said the German people were prepared for routing out and genocide of the Jews because religion had prepared them for it, and gave them the notion of totalitarianism; and there was an allegiance between Catholicism and Nazism, repeating myself is tiring, so I’m sure I will stop soon.

]]> By: neo-neocon http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90159 neo-neocon Mon, 27 Oct 2008 01:22:29 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90159 nyomythus: The Nazis did not use the Bible to justify their genocide. Au contraire. It had nothing to do with any sins of the fathers, either. They thought Jews were responsible for everything bad in the world and needed to be killed like vermin. You cannot eliminate religion. Human beings seek its comfort and yearn for the spiritual and the transcendental. If you try to outlaw it (as did the Soviets) you replace it with something worse. nyomythus: The Nazis did not use the Bible to justify their genocide. Au contraire. It had nothing to do with any sins of the fathers, either. They thought Jews were responsible for everything bad in the world and needed to be killed like vermin.

You cannot eliminate religion. Human beings seek its comfort and yearn for the spiritual and the transcendental. If you try to outlaw it (as did the Soviets) you replace it with something worse.

]]> By: nyomythus http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90158 nyomythus Mon, 27 Oct 2008 01:18:40 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90158 Double pasting, errors happen, were only human. Double pasting, errors happen, were only human.

]]> By: nyomythus http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90157 nyomythus Mon, 27 Oct 2008 01:17:26 +0000 http://neoneocon.com/2008/10/23/palin-and-pygmalion-who-said-class-is-dead-in-america/#comment-90157 I'm talking about the same Thomas Jefferson that wrote, "Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom" http://www.vahistorical.org/sva2003/vsrf.htm I’m talking about the same Thomas Jefferson that wrote, “Virginia Statute for Religious Freedom”

http://www.vahistorical.org/sva2003/vsrf.htm

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