April 1st, 2009

Feel overwhelmed? [continued]

Here’s an excerpt from a comment by “Wolla Dalbo” on yesterday’s post that I thought made some points well worth highlighting:

I believe that in order to understand what is going on, we have to apply a model radically different from the one we usually apply to the actions of politicians and Presidents here in the U.S. Greed, stupidity or incompetence we can understand, ruthlessness is also a given and pandering is taken for granted, too, but a grab for power so great that it will result in true Tyranny; that we are not used to thinking about and being on the look out for. Except for the application of this model by the Left to create their alternate world of the Bush Presidency—and a fine piece of projection that was, we do not really look for the telltale signs left by someone trying to set himself up as a tyrant or dictator as a way to comprehend what it is our President is up to; in the case of Obama, that is what we must do, and I think a moment’s reflection will demonstrate how this model fits.

Just ask yourself, if you, as a new President, were plunged into the midst of a major financial crisis as soon as you took office, would you be trying, in every way you could, to douse the flames, to calm the situation, or would you be throwing gasoline on the fire to make it bigger and hotter; what ends of yours would best be served by a bigger crisis and more panic, rather than less; panic, haste and confusion rather than clear thinking and analysis and deliberate, well thought out actions?

Would you be making taking control of the upcoming Census one of your immediate priorities in the first few weeks of your new Presidency, would you be involved, as well, in trying to acquire the ability to take over the Internet and disconnect certain parts of it, would you be trying, over and over in those critical first few weeks, to fund ACORN—a corrupt leftist organization that you have close ties with–with hundreds of millions of tax dollars, would you be concerned with changing obscure DOD procurement regulations so that ammunition supplies for civilians would start to dry up, or would you consider spending precious time to try to do any, much less all of these particular things in the midst of a crisis, a waste of precious time and a “distraction?”

I was certainly not seeking signs of tyranny in the Obama administration, nor am I a natural conspiracist. I tend to scoff at such things—after all, I was one of the few people in America who clung to the idea that Oswald acted alone.

Before Obama took office, I noticed some traits of his that concerned me (you can find the relevant posts under the category “Obama” on the right sidebar of this blog). His grandiosity and narcissism. His fostering of a trancelike hero-worship in his followers. His lack of humor. His complaints about being tired, used as an excuse for his errors. His ignorance of history. His hubris about his foreign policy background, based on his childhood and early adulthood sojourns and travels. His emphasis on “coolness” over substance. His breaking of his word on campaign finances. His associates, especially Wright and Ayers.

But I always maintained that the only way we would know Obama would be by his actions in office. There were worrisome indications that he would make poor judgments, or even that he would govern from the Left, but there were so many contradictory signals coming from him that one could not be sure of much of anything, especially what ideology might be driving him.

Right after the inauguration, I even wrote a piece for Pajamas Media cautioning against Obama Derangement Syndrome. In it I said:

Yes, there are reasons to fear that Obama has a far left agenda, based on his history, some of his own statements, and his associations. There are even reasons to believe that whether he does or doesn’t have such an agenda himself, he will lack the inclination (or perhaps the backbone) to stop the far left agenda of those with the power to pass bills — in other words, the hugely Democratic Congress and its leaders Reid and Pelosi.

But I suggest that everyone stand back, take a deep breath, and wait. Wait, and observe. It will become clear enough as Obama chooses a Cabinet and advisers. And then it will become even more clear as he takes office and begins the work of government. More clarity will come as he handles the inevitable crises and tests that will occur on his watch.

The goal of each of us should be to react only to evidence, not fear….It is necessary both for the sake of the country and our own well-being to give the man a chance to prove those fears wrong. And it is also necessary to hope that he will do so, and to believe that whatever happens, our Constitution and our form of government is not as fragile as all that.

Sounds fair, no? And I still fervently hope that that last phrase will prove true: …that whatever happens, our Constitution and our form of government is not as fragile as all that

But as far as the rest of it goes, I think the waiting is over; Obama has put enough cards on the table to see much of his hand. The reason I quoted Wolla Dalbo’s comment at such length at the beginning of this post is that I think it lays out quite succinctly some of the evidence that has amassed in the nearly ten weeks (has it only been that? How time doesn’t fly when one isn’t enjoying oneself) since Obama’s inauguration.

I didn’t expect evidence to accumulate so fast and to point at such a pessimistic conclusion. But it has. And, as the commenter points out, one of the biggest pieces in the “what does Obama want?” puzzle—perhaps the biggest—has been his upside-down priorities.

There’s his assertion that his shockingly expensive energy, education, health care budget is connected to the economic recovery when even a dim knowledge of financial realities dictates the exact opposite (this appears to be use of the time-honored technique of the Big Lie). There’s his outright fomenting of class war, his demonizing of Wall Street and the rich. His bait and switch on tax relief. His cavalier disregard for the huge additional stock market drop that has occurred on his watch. His favoritism towards ACORN. His attempt to create some sort of compulsory government service for young people. His push for card check and cap and trade, two proposals so far to the Left that even the Democrats in Congress are balking.

Obama came to office in the midst of a profound economic crisis, one that might even have been responsible for his winning the election. But it has taken his administration a surprisingly long time to get around to offering concrete and specific proposals to actually address it—for example, a scheme for evaluating the toxic assets. What’s more, the Treasury Department, which should have been his top priority, remains curiously vacant, with hapless Tim Geithner wandering all alone listening to the sound of his solitary footsteps in its echoing halls.

Although I remain open to evidence to the contrary, for now my working hypothesis is that Obama is a man of the Left, that he is insufficiently devoted to the age-old American idea of liberty but is instead a committed statist, and that the mind-numbing pace of his change is deliberate and has been effective so far.

I used the word “numbing” in the above paragraph, and I mean it. I noticed in the same comments section of yesterday’s post that another reader pointed out that “I am seeing the effect already amongst friends who have just stopped listening to any news.”

Oddly enough, this is what I have noticed among my liberal friends, Obama-supporters all. I cannot tell you how many times I have asked them what they think about Obama so far and they answer that they haven’t really had time to follow it all, and it’s all so very confusing.

Now it’s true that most of my liberal friends are not exactly newshounds, nor do they read blogs, even blogs on the Left. But it seems as though they are turning away from politics even more than usual, especially considering that they should be joyfully lapping up the wonderful news, now that their man Obama is in. I believe that their turning away is both an attempt at protecting themselves from the anxiety of hearing about the financial crisis, and a reaction to a feeling of “something just isn’t right with Obama” in the pits of their stomachs.

I am convinced that Obama is counting on this reaction. He knows the Left is behind him (except for a few details such as his Afghanistan policy, or those who think he’s not far enough to the Left in terms of his financial interventions). He knows those on the Right will despise him and what he’s doing. He knows both of those groups will be paying attention to the details.

But he also knows that those more in the middle will not be noticing much, until the deeds are done. And he is counting on them to look away and hope for the best. The question is whether his pace is fast enough, and whether they will catch on—and whether they will then understand what is happening, or care. Or will the predictions of the Grand Inquisitor come to pass in this country, as they have in so many others?

[NOTE: In case you missed it, here's the "Grand Inquisitor" quote from Dostoevsky's "The Brothers Karamazov" once again:

Oh, never, never can [people] feed themselves without us [the Inquisitors and controllers]! No science will give them bread so long as they remain free. In the end they will lay their freedom at our feet, and say to us, “Make us your slaves, but feed us.” They will understand themselves, at last, that freedom and bread enough for all are inconceivable together, for never, never will they be able to share between them! They will be convinced, too, that they can never be free, for they are weak, vicious, worthless, and rebellious. Thou didst promise them the bread of Heaven, but, I repeat again, can it compare with earthly bread in the eyes of the weak, ever sinful and ignoble race of man? ]

98 Responses to “Feel overwhelmed? [continued]”

  1. SteveH Says:

    There is no teflon like that afforded by Americans to a new President stepping into huge problems. This man has taken those good graces and stabbed every freedom loving person in the back with them. And the entire democrat party is complicit in all of it.

    I’ll agree with a commenter yesterday. Obama will not reside in this country after his term, if not sooner.

  2. Tom Says:

    Neo: To be worried, even frightened of Obama’s ascent to office was NOT to be DERANGED. Awaiting evidence of Obama’s misconduct is analogous to not shutting down terrorists until after they have done their foul deed(s) and then trying them in criminal courts based on evidence. “Beyond reasonable doubt” has no place in elective politics.

    We need to be screaming in raising the alarm. Yes, pre-emptively, but to wait until the damage has been done because we’re not absolutely sure about our intelligence?

    Please recall how long before the election I posted here multiple times OBAMA=CHAVEZ. I may have misunderestimated him at that.

    The cardinal feature of the Obama Derangement Syndrome is that it is rational, not psychotic. Other symptoms include the buying of guns, ammo, gold.
    Have you seen what the stock prices of Smith&Wesson and Ruger have done in recent weeks? Down today, but heretofore up sharply.

  3. stumbley Says:

    “most of my liberal friends are not exactly newshounds, nor do they read blogs, even blogs on the Left.”

    Indeed. And that’s why we’re saddled with the rampant statist that is Obama for President. I’ve found that most of those I know who favor “progressive” policies approach politics from an emotional, rather than a pragmatic position…and are woefully misinformed as to the potential results of those policies. We truly get the government we deserve, when we allow emotions to rule the voting booth.

  4. vanderleun Says:

    As my ol’ grandpappy used to say, “Hope in one hand. [Defecate] in the other. See which one fills up first.”

  5. Don Janousek Says:

    What causes me the greatest amount of apprehension is that there does not appear to be any credible restraining force to curtail, or at least put the brakes on, Obama and his ultra-radical program. With Congress dominated by the far left Democrats who have no interest whatsover in any bipartisan compromises, the congressional restraints faced by past Presidents, such as FDR and the conservative Democrats, or JFK and the southern Democrats, are just not there. I don’t see any way to stop this rapid descent into statism and beyond. The only thin hope might be to just pray that the Republic survives until 2010 and then do a congressional housecleaning, that is, if we still will be having elections in 2010.

  6. expat Says:

    I was like you, Neo, in taking a cautious wait-and-see attitude about his policies. That was my head; my gut was always mistrusting. What I’ve seen is that where he is completely in over his head, such as Iraq, Afghanistan, and security, he has turned to old pros and will let them run things for a while; I do suspect, however, that he has given them some obstacles to dodge.

    In areas where he feels more secure, he wants to run the show; no suggestions are heard and no contradictions are tolerated. He pats the uninquisitive on the head and says, don’t worry. Those who do question or raise their voices are subjected to the Emmanuel/Carville attack team.

    I can still use my head to critique what he does, but I won’t try to subdue my gut reaction to what he is: superficial, ignorant, manipulative, and extemely narcissistic. I will not be intimidated into giving up a lifetime of experience in learning how people and how the world work.

    Today Gordon Brown mentioned that Obama’s presidency signified a change in America and in the way America acted in the world. It makes me sick. We are not perfect, but what other country has its faults broadcast throught the world every single day? We need to be humble, but name a single country that hasn’t pulled the anti-American card when an election was in danger or an industry needed an advantage. Perhaps had Obama tried to present our country fairly over the past few years, I would feel differently. He didn’t; instead he fed the anti-American beasts and told them all he would stop the rising of the oceans. He promised them a new America that he would re-form to fit his own magnificent plans. Now he is making the grand appology tour. He doesn’t speak for me. He doesn’t even like people like me. We embarass him. I have no intention of hiding my anger at him or at his sycophants. I’ve spent my whole life testing the ground on which I stand. His BS is not gonna move me.

  7. Baklava Says:

    I felt the pure joy that many in America felt even though I am a conservative on Inaguration day.

    I was VERY happy that so many Americans felt ‘proud’ of their country and had a patriotic and great feeling about America again.

    Since that time my mood has been one of dismay and wonderment.

    I wonder if those same people have learned anything during these days. I have a hard time putting my finger on it.

    I’d love to hear from some of these same people that had such joy such as the cab driver who Dennis Miller talked about.

    Dennis Miller himself even discussed this new era and how he didn’t vote for Obama but he really really hopes Obama does well.

    What Dennis has seen over these weeks has been shocking.

    But Dennis didn’t vote for Obama.

    Are the Obama voters shocked in any way?

    Neo’s analysis is spot on when it comes to the Obama voters. The ones in my office have had NOTHING to say politically lately. They do NOT talk about politics.

    They are political no – nothings as I’ve seen. And now that Obama is doing many things with his power that are so controversial and without precedent it’s as if he is not doing anything……………………………………………………………

  8. FredHjr Says:

    Neo,

    Yesterday I had lunch with a couple of friends, one of whom is a woman who used to be a teacher and is well-traveled in Europe. Her husband is a professor at the University of New Hampshire (my alma mater). She is the mother of one son and two daughters. Her son works as an economist. She and her son did not vote for Obonga, so we have that (among other things in common). Her husband did, as did her two daughters. Her husband is experiencing buyer’s remorse. Anyway, she told me that she is absolutely stunned at the ignorance and emotionalism of the young people who voted for Obonga she knows. They seem to be putting up false fronts, yet leave crumbs of clues that they are having their doubts. Her husband just didn’t like Bush. Very few academics did. Her two daughters are still in college/grad school, and are thus not in the orbit of influence from conservative circles. She refuses to impose her views on others and I agree with her in that habit. She expressed the view I’ve inwardly known for a very long time: the young voters will simply have to learn from painful experience that the “progressive”/socialist/Marxist worldview is a loser and a disaster.

    Let me reiterate the view I will not move from without a very compelling counterview. It matches exactly the one articulated by Dick Morris (a man who I think is politically very smart). Obonga already knows he’s likely a one-termer. In his gut he knows, as do Pelosi and Reid, that they have to get this stuff they want done before 2010. In fact, they want to try to get it all this year, because they know that in 2010 a lot of Democrat representatives are going to see their party’s “accomplishments” as a millstone around their necks. What they hope for, I think, is that in 2013 and beyond they can hold to just enough seats in both houses to prevent the total rollback of much of what they will have rammed through this year.

    Deep down I think these people knew that most of the Middle Muddle they cajoled over their way, starting in 2006, was based upon an effective public shaming of and destruction of President Bush. The Alinsky Rules for Radicals to “freeze it, personalize it…” (and you all know the rest of that). Most of these people are not Far Left. The inroads of cultural Marxism are uneven in the body politic and culture of the nation. So, when they have to run on results the game is up. There is only so much the mainstream media can do to jazz up this shit sandwich and cover up its stink. They have to know that the lawsuits and criminal charges piling up on ACORN will just become too enormous to ignore. It’s all going to come crashing down on them. They know it. If they don’t then they are clearly delusional.

    I’m not a conspiratorialist in the way I think. I try to be a realist. Hell, even when I was a Marxist many years ago I had a realist streak in me, which was largely responsible for my taking certain critiques of socialism seriously enough to want to follow where that led – even when the more orthodox Marxists I rubbed elbows with thought I was wasting my time. These people may want to consolidate power, but they sure do not know how to govern. If you can’t govern effectively, which really entails being a realist and not an idealist, then your grabbing and grubbing for power will alienate a lot of people and win you more enemies.

    This guy Obonga is not a realist. I spotted that right away about him as soon as he was on my radar screen. He’s an idealistic Marxist who is drunk on power and has no F_ing clue as to how to govern. This guy is toast in 2012, and his party will dwindle to a slender majority in both houses in 2010.

  9. Artfldgr Says:

    they are turning away from politics even more than usual, especially considering that they should be joyfully lapping up the wonderful news, now that their man Obama is in. I believe that their turning away is both a attempt at protecting themselves from the anxiety of hearing about the financial crisis, and a reaction to a feeling of “something just isn’t right with Obama” in the pits of their stomachs.

    study germany…

    the worst part of all that was actually a subtlty…

    how does one resolve that one chose to help foment a person like hitler? that once strapped into the seat, one had to ride out the whole thing.

    i cant remember who said it, but it fits here like little else. when you read it imagine it is being said to the left useful idiots…

    sooner or later everyone eventually sits and dines at a table laden with the consequences of their actions and inactions.

    what your seeing is that they have no place to turn… so they are inverting into themselves and their ‘tiny’ worlds, which they thought informed them as to everywhere.

    what can they do now? they are responsible. they are now trying to avoid that stigma…

    its the slow motion versin of a person playing with a gun, and shooting their sister in the head… all in slow motion… once the whole enevitable end starts rushing up, and the inability to change the course once set… with such consequences…

    how can they continue to look?

    so many of my liberal friends are now in various forms of schism… some are like my parents, they are dying soon they say, and they dont want to pay attention to this… or like my other friends… who do not want to talk politics (now they have won, and are on the losing side), they just want to rent movies, and pretend that nothing will happen to them. like a child playing ball jacks on the yellow line of the highway…

    i await to see what the ‘friends’ who before the election said i must really hate people… the worst being from a devout communist who pretends to have read everyhing. he trained his kids so well, thee are destined for a life of misery… even in the best of worlds.

    this next picnic is going to be a bia.tch

    all i pray is that when they are in trouble, they dont remember me.

    even now, still in this writing, is nothing but denial.

    but if one knew the history, the goals, the dark history of venona, mitrokhen, golotysn, sejna, and others…

    all this was only a question of WHEN, not IF.

    and msot still trying to figure it out whether we are in it or not… still cant see all the arrows pointing to the huge war we are heading to… they cant even note the rhetoric

    got to go… i am late to see my wife… :)

  10. I R A Darth Aggie Says:

    This administration, more than any other, seems to treat the Constitution as a list of suggestions and not highest law of the land.

    First, compulsary volunteerism (ever hear of the 13th Amendment?), and now Eric Holder trying to find somone to say providing DC with a voting representative in the House is OK (represenation is based on statehood).

    The One is supposed to be this brilliant Constitutional expert. I don’t see it…

  11. huxley Says:

    Clearly Obama is rushing to cram as much of his big leftist domestic agenda down the collective throat as quickly as possible.

    More bad news — Obama’s Approval Index spiked upwards from +4 to +11 after Obama fired Wagoner. He couldn’t budge this number with three TV appearances, but slapping around a CEO did the trick.

    Expect Obama to lean more on class warfare in the weeks to come. I was thinking we were in the 1930s but maybe we are in the French Revolution.

  12. Baklava Says:

    Neo,

    In preparation for June…. yes I’m early..

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVqZOlt8AMA

  13. Baklava Says:

    Fred wrote, “He’s an idealistic Marxist who is drunk on power and has no F_ing clue as to how to govern. This guy is toast in 2012, and his party will dwindle to a slender majority in both houses in 2010.

    I hope you are right. But as long as I’ve studied politics (since 1991), it seems that less and less people actually do the due diligence of learning that journalism has died.

    Journalism will not right itself prior to 2012 in my eyes.

    If it does right itself to “REPORTING” the news then it’ll be the most patriotic thing journalists have done in my lifetime.

  14. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    FredHjr—My point is that from what are, very likely, his long considered and carefully calculated actions in just these first few weeks of his administration, it appears that Obama has no intention of giving up the Presidency in four or eight years, or perhaps ever, and that together, he and ACORN and the Census enumerators they will hire, his fervent supporters and those newly beholden to his administration—lots of Lefties and many new recipients of “tax credit” checks from the Obama administration–that will do their “mandatory” community service in the “people’s organizations” he is creating, will try their damnedest to see to it that the elections in 2010, 2012, and on into the future will no longer be relatively honest, but will be “fixed,” and turn out just as Obama wishes them to.

    Insuring a very long rule, indeed, by Obama’s version of something like the “Institutional Revolutionary Party,” that did rule Mexico for 70 years, is what all these initial moves are designed to achieve, and why the frantic haste of their implementation and their obvious incongruity, given the priorities and the kinds of steps one would normally, logically implement to fix our current “economic disaster,” is such a strong indication that Obama & Co. are, in reality, working frantically to put in place the mechanisms of a Tyranny, (under the guise of fixing our ailing economy) before we all have time to wise up to what his real agenda is and what is happening, and can do anything effective to stop him.

  15. Baklava Says:

    We can’t appeal to lefties or centrists with that view Wolla.

    I don’t even have that view.

    I think that Obama is only considering each of these issues as of very recently. And because of his lack of depth of knowledge or history on the issues is coming down on the “Think Progress” or “Move On” side of the equation on each issue.

    We must remember that he hasn’t run a hot dog stand. And now he’s running GM???

    He is an idealist for sure.

    But he does not know what it is he is doing with any great perspective.

    He hasn’t planned this soft tyranny. He is simply doing it.

  16. huxley Says:

    I doubt that Obama expects to be a one-termer. Almost everything he does focuses more power in Washington and more power under the Democratic Party. Why shouldn’t he be re-elected?

    I don’t know how far I go with the idea that Obama has Chavezian plans for himself and the country. Whatever his ultimate plans might be, though, they start with rewiring the United States as a political machine like Chicago.

  17. Baklava Says:

    The ends justify the means…..

    because to Obama, Wepublicans are evil

    He simply has no concept of what conservatives stand for because he hasn’t learned them.

    That is why his speeches are FILLED WITH STRAWMEN.

  18. huxley Says:

    And now the New Hampshire Union Leader has fallen into the ODarkness:

    For months, this newspaper has opposed President Obama’s bold, forward-thinking agenda. What a colossal mistake.

    We realize now that we were merely clinging to the discredited ideas of the past. Holding on to disposable relics like tradition, religion and the Constitution only delays the glorious new world that awaits us all.

    President Obama has shown America a bright, glimmering future full of widely shared prosperity and national nice-to-each-otherness. Only by universally embracing the President’s vision can this nation succeed and prosper. Resistance will bring nothing but social distortion, widespread panic and madness.

    President Obama has shown us all that to achieve the unrealized promise of this great nation, we must transcend outdated values such as public thrift, individual liberty and restrained government. All power must be shifted to Washington and deposited in the hands of a wise and benevolent ruler whose will is never questioned.

    April 1, 2009

  19. Baklava Says:

    NHUL wrote, “Only by universally embracing the President’s vision can this nation succeed and prosper.

    Submit or die…

    Oh. That is extreme Islam.

  20. Baklava Says:

    huxley, That sounds like satire.

  21. huxley Says:

    Really? And on such a beautiful day….

  22. dane Says:

    I just see this as typical Soviet style politics and life-style so for those who dread socialism it has gone way beyond that already (in attitude) all the way to communist. While the populace is standing in line for toilet paper the elite are in their Dacha’s drinking the best vodka and eating caviar (or in Obama’s case – Wagyu beef). It is the absolute attitude of the intellectually arrogant to lecture on how we can’t keep the thermostat on 72 all winter long – while he cranks his up to 80 +. He admonishes us to conserve energy which will cut down on our carbon footprint while he cranks up AF One to fly to Denver to sign a bill he could have signed in Washington, to Camp LeJeune to make a speech about his plans for withdrawal from Iraq, and flies out to LA for a little late night banter with Leno (not to mention the enormous cost of these trips – while he tells us to tighten our belts).

    And the saddest part is he believes his “do as I say not as I do” attitude is perfectly acceptable because he and his agenda are so much important than our mundane lives.

    Besides he knows he got away with almost everything during the campaign – the people gave him a pass. Why would he not be emboldened?

  23. Roy Lofquist Says:

    Nobody has mentioned one of the most blatant and disturbing of his power grabs – the appointment of Czars and commissions. These take powers that are normally lodged in the Cabinet, which is subject to Senate confirmation, and given to his own selected people.

    Senator Byrd sent a letter to Obama complaining specifically about this, proclaiming that this looked like an attempt to subvert the Congress’ overview authority.

    The Republicans are not powerless. There is a weapon more powerful than the Filibuster. It is the privilege of any Senator to require that any bill must be read in full on the floor in open session. This tactic was used recently (can’t find the links) and killed a bill that the Dem’s had the strength to pass.

    This is the thermonuclear option. Used on all bills it stops the Congress dead in its tracks. Nothing gets done. I have detected hints in the penumbra that this is under discussion as an option.

  24. “Dove il sol tace” [Dan Collins] Says:

    [...] thoughts on the Per Se Angels, from Dan Riehl and Neo-Neo. Posted by Dan Collins @ 3:34 pm | Trackback SHARETHIS.addEntry({ title: ““Dove il sol [...]

  25. Artfldgr Says:

    These people may want to consolidate power, but they sure do not know how to govern.

    (I keep posting key documents that reveal core things that make stuff easier to understand – this will be probably the 7th or 8th time for this author below)

    please note which models they are following, and the core, and that they are following a historical line…

    one thing is to get a better grip on language than is now generally used! how many people hear can call a duck a duck no matter what someone else calls it? actually very few (studies have shown this).

    the councils that are being worked on, in obamas case they are community stuff, in chavez case they are councils, in stalins case they were soviets.

    sergey, can you give a good translation for what a “soviet” is? what the word means.

    George Kennan, “The Sources of Soviet Conduct” (1947)
    http://www.historyguide.org/Europe/kennan.html

    The political personality of Soviet power as we know it today is the product of ideology and circumstances: ideology inherited by the present Soviet leaders from the movement in which they had their political origin, and circumstances of the power which they now have exercised for nearly three decades in Russia. There can be few tasks of psychological analysis more difficult than to try to trace the interaction of these two forces and the relative role of each in the determination of official Soviet conduct. yet the attempt must be made if that conduct is to be understood and effectively countered.

    tough yes, but the past was full of better thinkers.

    kennan points out some key things that even now have remained unchanged, as they are fixed from the circumstances of its birth and so every thing after shares its stamp.

    The rest may be outlined in Lenin’s own words: “Unevenness of economic and political development is the inflexible law of capitalism. It follows from this that the victory of Socialism may come originally in a few capitalist countries or even in a single capitalist country. The victorious proletariat of that country, having expropriated the capitalists and having organized Socialist production at home, would rise against the remaining capitalist world, drawing to itself in the process the oppressed classes of other countries.” It must be noted that there was no assumption that capitalism would perish without proletarian revolution. A final push was needed from a revolutionary proletariat movement in order to tip over the tottering structure. But it was regarded as inevitable that sooner of later that push be given.

    how many read this old stuff and understand the mindset from when we knew the mindset as different than what we were?

    For 50 years prior to the outbreak of the Revolution, this pattern of thought had exercised great fascination for the members of the Russian revolutionary movement. Frustrated, discontented, hopeless of finding self-expression — or too impatient to seek it — in the confining limits of the Tsarist political system, yet lacking wide popular support or their choice of bloody revolution as a means of social betterment, these revolutionists found in Marxist theory a highly convenient rationalization for their own instinctive desires. It afforded pseudo-scientific justification for their impatience, for their categoric denial of all value in the Tsarist system, for their yearning for power and revenge and for their inclination to cut corners in the pursuit of it. It is therefore no wonder that they had come to believe implicitly in the truth and soundness of the Marxist-Leninist teachings, so congenial to their own impulses and emotions. Their sincerity need not be impugned. This is a phenomenon as old as human nature itself. It is has never been more aptly described than by Edward Gibbon, who wrote in The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire: “From enthusiasm to imposture the step is perilous and slippery; the demon of Socrates affords a memorable instance of how a wise man may deceive himself, how a good man may deceive others, how the conscience may slumber in a mixed and middle state between self-illusion and voluntary fraud.” And it was with this set of conceptions that the members of the Bolshevik Party entered into power.

    and here is the paragraph that addresses the line from fredhjr.

    Now it must be noted that through all the years of preparation for revolution, the attention of these men, as indeed of Marx himself, had been centered less on the future form which Socialism would take than on the necessary overthrow of rival power which, in their view, had to precede the introduction of Socialism. Their views, therefore, on the positive program to be put into effect, once power was attained, were for the most part nebulous, visionary and impractical. beyond the nationalization of industry and the expropriation of large private capital holdings there was no agreed program.

    sound familiar? even the testimony of the FBI agent with the weather underground heard the same…

    I brought up the subject of what’s going to happen after we take over the government. We become responsible then for administrating 250 million people … and there was no answers. No one had given any thought to economics. How are you going to clothe and feed these people?

    The only thing that I could get was that they expected that the Cubans, and the North Vietnamese and the Chinese and the Russians would all want to occupy different portions of the United States.

    They also believed that their immediate responsibility would be to protect against what they called the counter-revolution. They felt that this counter-revolution could best be guarded against by creating and establishing re-education centers in the Southwest, where we would take all of the people who needed to be re-educated into the new way of thinking and teach them how things were going to be. I asked, well what is going to happen to those people that we can’t re-educate that are die-hard capitalists? The reply was that they would have to be eliminated. When I pursued this further they estimated that they would have to eliminate 25 million people in these re-education centers. When I say eliminate, I mean kill … 25 million people.

    that was the words from that agent from that period..

    again… will and expertise in usurping power, no skill in governance at all…

    [edited for length by neo-neocon]

  26. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    My view is that Obama is not an idealist by any means, and the evidence for this would have been there for all to see and evaluate had not the MSM been 150% on his side, and ignoring or covering things up as fast as they were exposed by the few investigators and journalists—a lot of them British–interested in looking for them.

    In fact, Obama was surrounded all his life by Marxists and those on the far left; the absent father Obama idolized was a Socialist, who, as a Kenyan government functionary, created a set of Socialist proposals for governing Kenya. Obama’s mother was on the far left of the spectrum, too. Although from what Obama wrote in his autobiographical “Dreams From My Father,” it appears that Obama did not have a lot of respect for his maternal grandfather, he did have a lot of respect for “Frank,” the black father substitute and mentor of his teen age years, or even from perhaps as early as 10, until Obama went off to college at 17.

    American newspapers didn’t report it, but as reporters for British newspapers discovered and reported, “Frank” was, in fact, Frank Marshall Davis, who has been described as an “angry black man,” a hard drinking, marijuana smoking newspaperman and “poet” living in Hawaii, who was also reportedly a member of the Communist Party, identified so by the Hawaiian government, had come to the attention of HUAC, and had a long FBI dossier; he was, incidentally, author under a pseudonym (although he later admitted his authorship), of an extremely pornographic sexual autobiography, and according to this work, a self identified “pervert” who liked to be humiliated, a bisexual, exhibitionist, sadomasochist and voyeur, who liked “threesomes,” and used to cruise Honolulu for sex partners for himself and his wife—men, women and, sometimes, children ( see http://tinyurl.com/5dnw8u and http://tinyurl.com/25j8qv).

    Then there was Obama’s longstanding friendship (that may have started as far back as when they were both attending college in New York City at the same time, a few blocks from each other, and both had the far left Muslim Edward Said as a friend in common) and association with Marxist, unrepentant urban terrorist Bill Ayers and his wife, Bernadine Dohrn, and Obama’s admission in “Dreams” that he deliberately sought out Marxists on campus to talk “revolution” with long into the night.

    Then there is Obama’s 20 year membership at the Rev. “God Damn America” Wright’s Trinity United Church of Christ; 20 years spent listening to Wright’s explicit hatred of Whites and Jews, and his Marxist oriented “Black Liberation Theology,” and Obama’s approval and agreement with Wrights’ diagnosis that “White greed rules a world in need.”

    Let’s not forget Obama’s schooling in Marxist agitator Saul Alinsky’s manipulative, amoral “Rules For Radicals,” and his application of them for four years as a “community organizer.”

    Last but not least, was Obama’s four year stint as the Director of the Annenberg Challenge in Chicago, working daily with Bill Ayers to channel $110 million dollars or more to far left organizations specializing in political indoctrination and Black identity politics. There are also Obama’s mysterious ties to the far left indoctrination programs run by the “community organizers” of the shadowy Gamaliel Foundation; perhaps a model for the kinds of indoctrination that will be dished out to those serving their mandatory time in all his new public service organizations.

    So is Obama an “idealist”? Absolutely not! Is he some sort of a Marxist? You betcha!

  27. br549 Says:

    I don’t speak as eloquently as most of you. But I have felt and seen what you are feeling and seeing, and may have been saying it longer. I am relatively new to this blog.

    I am more angry than scared. I have three children and a grand baby boy.

    There were riots in Greece. In France. We are seeing riots in London. Will we see them in NY? DC? We have many “Londons”.

    Take all the individual happenings, and lay them out before you. All of them. Look at them hard, one at a time, and as a group. Don’t turn away. Look hard at Frank’s contributions lately, as well as before. Dodd, Pelosi, Schumer. The shrinking away of the republicans. Do we really have to mention ACORN again? The good old mayor of Chicago, although just a business as usual Chicago politician, was perhaps silenced before he could spill some beans in an effort for a power play of his own.

    I would love to be laughed at and thought of as a loon, a paranoid delusional – if I were wrong. I could handle that, and would deserve it. I thought perhaps I was for a while. But I’m not.

    The biggest denial I see is the belief of too many that “it can’t happen here”. Well, it can and it is happening here. And millions actually want it to. We have just enough freedom left at this time that we are allowed to speak out about it. But venting is only keeping things below the boiling point, holding back what may well be the inevitable somewhere down the road.

  28. huxley Says:

    br549 — I was talking with a good friend and he was talking with one of his friends and we all agree that for the first time we fear for our country.

    I am mostly an optimist and I still think this is a helluva strong country but I do think we are peering into the abyss in a way we haven’t since the Cuban Missile Crisis.

    And I do notice that my liberal friends have all shut up.

  29. mimi sk Says:

    As an aside: I do think the UL thing IS satire, but these given the lack of thinking skills “journalists” seems to have these days, it may not be satire. Newspapers are the buggy whips of the past. A fact I find very sad. But, they’ve been instrumental in their own demise to an extent by alienating a portion of their former customers. Either way, our society doesn’t read newspapers much anymore.

    Obama’s presidency is the symptom of a country that has discarded its foundation. The right reaps the result of a weak leadership unable to cope. The left has been busy seeding its philosophy for years in our educational system. It has now found its moment with many models of fascism to choose from. We can persist with our dissent, but we don’t have momentum on our side. And most people haven’t the capacity to recognize that a new set of commandments will be directing their lives quickly. We’re adaptive and it will adapt. What might have been or should have been will not play a part.

    I’d like to think there will be some awakening, and probably be a little push back bit here and there, but events like this generally cannot be undone. We’re witnessing a social shift and usually those shifts change the game. I think the game has been changed quite significantly.

  30. huxley Says:

    As an aside: I do think the UL thing IS satire…

    For those curious, I recommend clicking on the date link for the Union Leader editorial and decide for themselves.

    April 1, 2009

  31. Jamie Irons Says:

    Neo,

    What astonishes me is that Obama’s firing of the CEO of General Motors has attracted so little notice or excitement. Not only is GM an iconic American firm, but it is the very model of a teetering, old-style American manufacturing firm, so it clearly “needed to change.” But what a change!

    From what I read, Mr. Wagoner, for all his faults, was instituting some far-reaching changes, and he certainly was not passively sitting around letting the company go to hell.

    Now one could certainly argue about whether Wagoner was doing the right thing(s), but Obama, by his actions, has told the country and the world that he is, to use the unfortunate Bush term, “the decider” when it comes to the American automobile industry.

    This is a move of such towering hubris that I am stunned both by the move itself, and by the passive reaction of the entire press and the chattering class.

    What the hell is going on with our country?

    Jamie Irons

  32. mimi sk Says:

    I apologize for not editing my previous comment carefully.

  33. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    Sinclair Lewis’ 1935 book, “It Can’t Happen Here,” about the rise of Fascism in America, was a tough sell to American TV networks in later decades, because TV executives believed it was too fantastic; because they believed “It Can’t Happen Here” in America. This same sort of mind-set, this naiveté, this “unbelief,” is what Obama & Co. are hoping still prevails in America; they are counting on the fact that, by the time our deliberately uneducated, leftist indoctrinated and relatively innocent populace catches on, by the time that they realize that it not only “Can Happen Here” but that, in fact, it has “Happened Here,” it will be too late to oppose Obama & Co., short of civil war.

    And once the great mass of Americans—a lot of them determined and quite well armed–catch on, Rebellion, Civil War and/or secession or partition is likely inevitable.

  34. jon baker Says:

    “would you be concerned with changing obscure DOD procurement regulations so that ammunition supplies for civilians would start to dry up,”

    This I would like to hear more about- first I have heard of this.

    Also, please do not ignore the pending “HR 875 Food Safety Modernization Act” which, if passed will require all cattle raisers who sell cattle for food and all farmers, including your farmers market guys, to register with the Federal Gov, fill out all kinds of paperwork, submit to inspections, etc. This is far bigger than many conservatives seem to realize. It will efectively put the food supply in far fewer hands as many of the little guys will get out just because of the paperwork. There are large numbers of cattle guys who have regular jobs or are retired and just raise a few cows on the side, this will drive them out. Also, implied in this bill is a very large force needed for the inspections of all farms
    See link here: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h875/show

  35. armchair pessimist Says:

    I believe that Obama brought Marxism to the party; Soros and the other world-plutocrats brought greed. Both agreed that our United States of America with its cranky traditions of freedom and law is a big nail that is to be hammered down. That accomplished, how well they sleep together is to be seen. Meanwhile, every battle has been lost, but not yet the war.

    So, the burning issue of our movement: What is to be done?

  36. jon baker Says:

    This link is mainly about Texas farms, has lots of stats, but also has address for Federal report on US Farms. Look at how many small farms there are:
    http://www.tylerpaper.com/article/20090322/BUSINESS0502/903210298

  37. jon baker Says:

    I might add, fewer operating farms will make it easier to nationalize the food supply. Anyone ever heard of the famine in the Ukraine?

  38. FredHjr Says:

    Wolla,

    I am only going to say this once. Because at one time I was an academic Marxist, have studied and majored in philosophy in grad school in the seminary, and studied economics, I know Marxists and their philosophy quite well. Marxists are idealists. The essence exactly is an ideal world. Not a real world, sir. I am quite aware of all the things you cite about Obama’s background. I did my homework. Trust me, he is an idealist.

    There is no way that this man is grounded in reality. You and I are realists. Not Obama.

    Nothing this man has done in his life is grounded in reality. He lives in a world that does not exist and is determined to make that discordant experiential world conform to his dreams. The key to everything about the man is that word: DREAM.

    Idealists are tyrants too. Have you read Plato’s “Republic”?

    However, his lack of grounding in reality – and I include the leadership of his party – will cause mistakes, overreach, miscalculation, and the plenteous application of the law of unintended consequences. Are you suggesting that they will get away with this unscathed?

    I understand exactly how the ground was seeded for their election victories in 2006 and 2008. Completely understand it. But this time there is no President Bush to bash every day and with impunity. It will be harder to have effective scapegoats for these people.

    No, I do not believe he will succeed in destroying our Republic and become Hugo Chavez North. We will stop him, one way or another. Most likely, by the ballot box in the stages I’ve described. Failing that, we could be driven into civil war, where Leftists are going to be killed by the bushel. As I’ve stated before: we are advancing on a titanic showdown with Marxism in this country. We are going to have it out with these people, either peacefully or with violence. I pray that it will be done peacefully. I believe it will be. But in case the absolute worst should happen, I am prepared to do my duty.

  39. neo-neocon Says:

    huxley: French Revolution, for sure.

    Ah, but that ended so well, didn’t it?

  40. SteveH Says:

    “”Meanwhile, every battle has been lost, but not yet the war.
    armchair pessimist”"

    Theres a part of me that is oddly assured in this stunning level of a power grab so early on. I can think of more subtle policies stretched out over time that would be more hideous by better staying under the radar.

    Leftist cannot help themselves from making major mistakes in their zeal. And there will be big game changing ones coming that will likely topple this administrations house of cards.

  41. FredHjr Says:

    Wolla,

    In case of civil war/rebellion, it is unconscionable that the country be partitioned. It is wrong to abandon the many patriots like myself, ensconced in a strongly blue state (New Hampshire). I will not uproot and move my family. I stand here and fight here. We must not divide regionally or by states, but have this division according to ideology. If the worst happens, we have to kill the enemy in both red and blue states. They’re everywhere. And they will die everywhere. A partitioned America is ridiculous. If we have to, let us root the enemy out where they are and make them die where they stand.

  42. FredHjr Says:

    Let us remember that the people we are at war with believe our Constitution and Bill of Rights are deeply flawed. It means that their vision of how the country should have been founded vs. how it was founded are at loggerheads. They don’t believe in it. They consider the Communist Manifesto to be the real revolutionary clarion call. Well, we have to disabuse them of their plans, one way or another.

    We are very forthright and honest about our beliefs and what we stand for. We don’t hide our intentions. But they hide and obfuscate because they know that what they want is still at variance with much of the population. They know they don’t have the power or the force to make it so. They don’t want to have to slug it out in the open.

    They stand for an entirely different moral order than the one we stand for. And lest any of you consider my remarks intemperate, consider the fact that this is not just a fight to preserve our liberties and our Constitution: it is a fight for the very survival of Western Civilization itself. These are bad people we are engaged in this struggle against.

  43. jon baker Says:

    FredHjr,

    well, umm, how do I say this…..have you ever heard of a little place called “Cottonwood” … I mean, in Espanol, the “Alamo.” ? That is what you may be describing if you make a last stand completely outnumbered……just saying….

  44. FredHjr Says:

    jon,

    I don’t know many Leftists who are armed, have military training, know how to shoot, or even have the testicular fortitude to do that sort of thing.

    U.S. military is not going to stand by tyranny. Some might. Any tyrant can buy a praetorian guard, but I believe most of our men are not mercenary thugs.

    Most of the men I know are within the orbit of my thoughts. Determined to effect political change and willing to put skin in the game. But also, if the worst happens, have been storing ammo.

    The other side will have the praetorian guard, the gangs, and some contingents of young Communists/socialists/progressives who will be no match for us.

  45. Thomass Says:

    FredHjr Says:

    “Marxists are idealists.”

    Some of it is the good / bad scale. Some people can’t get beyond it. Idealist sounds ‘good’ so how can bad people be it (or worse, a good person be pushed to do bad things)?

    I’d say any group can go extreme and do evil in their group’s name. Even the religious. So, saying some is an idealist is generally a value neutral statement. Some priests, fighting for an ideology, can be a bloodthirsty as military officers… and vice versa for both groups (some can be compassionate and humane)…

  46. betsybounds Says:

    Wolla Dablo says many of the things I’ve been saying to a few friends for months now. Most of them have thought me a bit nuts-o–you know, along the lines of, “Oh there she goes again!” But, well–these guys have been planning this for a long time, that’s what I think–that’s in large part why it’s moving so fast–and the Republicans (such as they are) are easy marks for having failed, over the last long years and continuing even until this very day, to recognize the nature and stakes of the battle they (we) are in. What we are seeing is not now, and has not been for some long time, anything like “politics as usual.” This is the revolution many of my generation from the ’60s have worked and longed for ever since we were young. We are witnessing a coup d’etat, in somewhat slow motion–albeit not so slow NOW. Someone above (sorry, I forget who precisely) said that we must hold on for 2010, when these guys will be swept from office by a newly awakened electorate, and their changes will be rolled back. I fear it will not be so. The changes will not be rolled back, and these guys know it. We may not even see free elections at all in 2010, much less in 2012. The United States of America as we and our forefathers have known it since the Founding is dying before our eyes. No, sorry–not dying. It is being slaughtered. And there is no one in that Goon Show on the Potomac to stop it. NO ONE. Who’s there to stop it? This new order will have to be overthrown–by force. I take no pleasure in this, but I fear it is true. I heard last night that there is a new act going through Congress, starting, as it must, in the House, that will impose a “fee” (nicely named, that) on any and all firms fulfilling government contracts exceeding 10 million dollars per year in value (I’d guess that quite a few government contracts exceed 10 million dollars per year in value); the purpose of this fee is to provide monies to fund Congressional re-election campaigns. I doubt many have heard of it, yet it is already in motion. How much other legislation is worming its way through the process, escaping notice? I do not doubt that there is more. Soon we will see talk radio shut down, and censoring control exerted over the Internet–in the interest of fairness and the preservation of public order, doubtless. And who can be against fairness and the preservation of public order? As with Progressivism–who, after all, can be be against Progress?

    I’m bewildered by the Republican conservatives in Congress–for example, Paul Ryan (R-WI). He’s a good man, but what on earth is he doing dwelling on how many dollars this program is going to cost?? No one cares much how many DOLLARS it will COST–none of it will be defeated on that ground. The dollar amounts are already so staggering that they don’t even seem real to most of us. No: The problem, which nary a Republican in Congress has the either the brains or the balls to bring up, is that it is going to cost us our FREEDOM. Where is the Man-Jack among these weasels who will bring that up, and press it home? WHERE?

    My son has been talking about leaving this country before it gets too awful. It breaks my heart to hear him say this. I’m not sure where he might think to go, where it will be better. I’ve had the awful thought that some Americans might be prevented from leaving–perhaps under the guise of closing some tax-avoidance “loophole” or other. I recall that one of the hallmarks of Communist tyrannies over the years is their effective imprisonment of their citizens–people were not free to leave. That was the whole, entire point of the Berlin Wall, for example. It wasn’t to keep people OUT. It was to keep people IN. It used to be no problem to leave the US. You didn’t need a passport to leave; you needed one to get in somewhere else. But Americans could leave here any time they wished. I think that is going to change.

    I read the opinions of many on the internet that Obama is leading us into European-style Social Democracy. I think rather differently. I think that, by the time these guys are done, we will wish we could GET a European-style Social Democracy. I think that what we are headed for is going to be a good deal worse than that. And it will not be easily undone.

    My father, who was a member of The Greatest Generation and fought in the South Pacific, used to say that if the American people wanted good government, they’d vote for it. He was right–back then. The franchise is, however, on the cusp of losing its value. No, instead we’re approaching the point where it’ll be more apt to say that if the American people want good government, they’re going to have to fight for it.

    Adieu, l’ancien regime.

  47. FredHjr Says:

    Thomass,

    Have you studied the writings of the Marxist thinkers? Do you know that in Philosophy “idealism” has a very specific, technical meaning? The common understanding of that term is debased in normal conversation. Idealism is a way of thinking that says that reality is or ought to conform to ever greater conformity to “the ideas.” I subscribe to the correspondence theory of truth, whereby objective reality contains truth. My mind does not impose truth on reality: it makes a claim on me.

    The founders of this nation believed in natural law and objective truth. They were not idealists, but quite the opposite. A moral demand and an epistemological claim is made on us which we have to respect.

  48. davidt Says:

    Much of this discussion seems to be based on the premise that Obama himself is actually the prime mover of all these ‘changes’, and is not simply the front man for the real movers and shakers, as I believe. I’m curious how the commenters here might answer the question, “Is Obama in charge?”

  49. ipw533 Says:

    An analogy, at the risk of invoking Godwin’s Law. When Hitler launched Operation Babarossa on 22 Jun 41, he announced that “The world will hold its breath”. Obama’s plans are no less audacious, and no less fragile.

    Operation Barbarossa, like Obama’s plan, depended upon speed and force but was hamstrung by poor logistics and a gross misunderstanding of the Russians on a basic level.

    To succeed, Operation Barbarossa had to destroy the Soviet military as an effective fighting force west of the Dnepr and Dvina Rivers–which meant that it had to be done within a matter of weeks. Otherwise the Russians would slowly but surely recover and crush the Germans. The gamble failed, and by August the first signs of a real Russian recovery could be seen in battles like Smolensk.

    Obama has a much more complicated job to do, and he’s hamstrung on his side by a largely discredited Congress and Cabinet selections that are becoming increasingly discredited. Resistance–even if its the most passive sort–is growing among the American people. The campaign is over and Obama must deliver–what he is delivering is not being as widely accepted as he wants to believe.

    He’s on a fairly tight leash, as far as time goes. He’s safe until 2012, but his Congress is in the crosshairs in 2010 and without them he’s dead in the water. News flash, Barry–it’s 2009 and people are already grumbling before they’ve even cleaned up after your inauguration. Even your own party is tripping over some of your proposals like card check, and the Congressional rank and file are looking nervously at their constituents back in Flyover Land.

    It will get worse for Obama, and he’s sure to make it worse by playing the two-bit Chicago hustler he is instead of growing into the House we so foolishly lent him. In that respect he’s no different than another audacious thug who overreached, rode high for a time and then fell. Mr. Obama, if Mr. Hitler is not to your liking then perhaps you’d like to speak to Mr. Capone–you can call him Al….

  50. rickl Says:

    Some great comments here, especially FredHjr and betsybounds.

    I live in Pennsylvania, I am armed, and I’m not going anywhere either.

    All I can say is that we should have killed a lot more Communists here in the USA back in the 50s and 60s. We might have been able to avert the impending nightmare we face today.

  51. Tom Says:

    I am heartened by the militancy evinced by the posters; it is good not to feel alone and forlorn. The Left is everywhere, so we’ll deal with them wherever we live. We must prepare for more than the elections of 2010, which will be rigged by Rahm anyway. Who’s going to watch the polls? Jimma Carter? Heh. If by a miracle it’s done peacefully, Hurray.

    But I doubt it will. Leadership and time are our principal deficits. The Left has had complacent, tolerant decades to get to where it is now. “If ’twere done, ’twere well it were done quickly”, if I remember my Shakespeare.

  52. FredHjr Says:

    I have decidedly more mixed feelings about the 1973 Chilean coup that removed Salvador Allende than I did in my Leftist days. I have learned more about what Allende was doing and was planning to do, which was monstrously no good at all. He fooled a lot of the Chileans who were not Communists at all and who voted for someone they thought was a soft-socialist, but who was in fact very hard Communist. The Communists used the ballot box in Chile to gain power, and then they were taking measures to consolidate more power and to shut out the opposition.

    For the record, I think Pinochet’s people made a lot of mistakes too, as there were people swept up the liquidation of the Left who should never have been put to death. This is one of the dangers of rebellions and a mistake which, if we should ever have to cross a Rubicon, we should avoid. But we have to be clear about who truly must be arrested, detained, and tried. I would not go after the “soft Left.” But there most definitely is a Hard Left in this country that may have to be dealt with swiftly. And I do mean swiftly, because those rats would try to get out of the country and try to enlist the help of our enemies overseas.

    If you want to know who are the people who must either be captured or killed, read former CIA analyst Robert Chandler’s book, “Shadow World: Resurgent Russia, the Global New Left, and Radical Islam.” That book names names of who the people are who are in the process of destroying this nation. If I had to compile a proscription list, his book is a great starting point.

    Salvador Allende deserved what he got. It is obscene how the Left has made a hero out of this dangerous man.

  53. Oblio Says:

    A charming little story about Eric Holder via Powerline:

    http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2009/04/023223.php

    The bottom line is the complete politicization of the Department of Justice on a core Constitutional issue. As I recall, this charge was previously projected on to the Bush administration.

  54. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    What I find so very curious is that, while a lot of us here on the Internet are concerned about all of the specific, objective, radical, game-changing, “revolutionary” changes Obama & Co. are ramming so hurriedly through Congress– extraordinarily radical, revolutionary and costly changes that look to many of us like steps preparatory to the establishment of a Tyranny– those of our elected representatives in Congress at least nominally identified as Republicans seem not to be concerned at all, or to be bleating about “bipartisanship,” instead of forming an implacable, immovable block to oppose every step taken by Obama & Co. that even remotely look like possible steps towards Tyranny. Do they think that by “going along to get along” they will somehow be able to plead ignorance, or good intentions, or to be held blameless when it all hits the fan?

  55. FredHjr Says:

    I am on a blog discussion about two books that one would suggest that Obama read. I suggested two very important works.

    1. Thomas Aquinas’ “Summa Theologica” – in order to be grounded in natural law and orthodox belief and spirituality (to cleanse his mind of that heretic Jeremiah Wright).

    2. Friedrich Hayek’s “The Road to Serfdom” – for obvious reasons.

  56. Oblio Says:

    Fred, I’m sure that you saw a Chilean Marxist, former terrorist, now a lawyer, is the moving force behind the pressure in the Spanish courts to indict Alberto Gonzales, John Yoo, Doug Feith and other Bush administration lawyers as war criminals.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/29/world/europe/29spain.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=%22Spanish%20court%22&st=cse

    What to do if the lawyers become lawless?

  57. FredHjr Says:

    Oblio,

    I was never for a moment fooled by the Holder nomination, nor did I ever think he would uphold his oath. The man is an abomination to his office, and he will, just as his boss and their party will, do things that will be trapped by the law of unintended consequences.

    The arrogance and immorality of these people should surprise no one. At every step they are backing up their view that the U.S. Constitution is a “flawed document.” This view pervades the law schools and legal ranks of this nation. At the very least, it is elitist, and at its worst manifests a desire to simply do away with the constraints on government.

  58. FredHjr Says:

    “What to do if the lawyers become lawless?”

    To be blunt, Oblio, you declare them reprobates and you kill them.

  59. Baklava Says:

    Fred, Your 9:24 post was so very good. It’s the way I feel.

  60. Thomass Says:

    FredHjr Says:

    “Have you studied the writings of the Marxist thinkers?”

    Yes… that and I agreed with you.

  61. Maquis Says:

    Quelle un monde!

  62. David Says:

    … while you all are so much into Obama-praize
    … some more fuel to your enthusiasm … while the link @ the end clearly shows: all of this could be said more funny.

    “Obama has proposed and planned to:

    * create a 34% increase in spending in ONE year
    * take the national debt to 82% of our GDP
    * double the size of our national debt compared to our economy
    * create a $645 Billion energy tax increase for consumers

    You think he could have got elected on that platform? Doubt it.

    Worse? He promised that every bill would be visible on the inernet for five days on the internet so that every citizen could read it before he signed it. Yet the $787B, 1100 page stimulus bill was forced through in 24 hours, without even giving time for Congress to read it before voting on it.”
    (from: http://www.twoorthree.net/2009/04/obama-will-be-the-farthest-left-at-the-g20-economic-summit.html) … the brighter side of the dark:
    For The Record : Democratic Dyslexic Disorder:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6XcgsVzT_c&feature=related

  63. br549 Says:

    As others have stated, and if it comes to that, I will take my stand on the inside of the Alamo.

    Again, our military is sworn to uphold the Constitution. To protect against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

    Consider the DC area. Just about every military officer inside the Pentagon is armed. Belvoir is right there. Quantico is a skip, hop, and wobble down the road.

    Most of those in congress and the administration couldn’t punch their way out of a beauty parlor, as my dad used to say.

  64. Oblio Says:

    Fred, you are talking about something very close to a Hobbesian State of Nature. We’re not close to that, and it is not helpful to talk as if we were.

    We will face specific tactical and political problems involving the administration of justice long before actual war breaks out.

    National Review thinks John Roberts will be the next target for the Left’s daily Two-Minute Hate.

    At the limit, Cicero is with you: Inter arma silent leges.

  65. mimi sk Says:

    Here’s hoping we don’t come such a critical state as to raise up in arms.

    Most people aren’t inclined or have time to bother with details beyond what they might here from MSM. The snippets of information are not meant to inform so much as to sway, and that fact may not play an important role in their lives. Or even if it is important, they aren’t in the position or have the time to search out information.

    The think the Internet gives those of us keeping track a false sense. In reality I think these blogs reflect a minority. We just had an election that proves my point. We voted for an American Idol and got the change we were all waiting for.

    When or if there were to be a “showdown,” my gut feeling is there really won’t be many of us “showing up.”

  66. armchair pessimist Says:

    I have to live up to my name and wonder aloud if people are too lazy, too stupid and, frankly, too poisoned to be capable of self-government any longer. And if they aren’t, end of story.

    Perhaps there will be remote parts of US territory where cranks like us can go and live our version of the Taliban. That’s the most optimistic scenario I can imagine.

  67. SouthernJames Says:

    I wish I could share the confidence that some commentators have when they talk about things like a “civil war” which we will win, because “we” will out shoot them, and liberals don’t like or own guns, etc.

    I don’t think it is ever going to come to that.

    For one thing, I think we are in our own little echo chamber. We who read and post on blogs like this are the right’s version of the Code Pink ladies, IMO. We who read and post on blogs like this are like that McGovern voting reporter in NYC all those years ago who expressed surprise that McGovern lost because everyone she knew voted for him.

    We are a tiny minority. As our gracious hostess has already pointed out, the vast majority of our fellow citizens are fast asleep and want to stay that way. And the numbers of non-tax paying functional illiterates who are eager for even more Govt freebies and more than happy to be total dependants on Aunt Nanny State, can and will outvote us 5 to 1. With the massive Amnesty (and voting rights) coming for welfare state dependant illegals; combined with Acorn voting oversight and Census control in the hands of the leftists……I think we’re dreaming if we think we can simply have a repeat of the 1980 or the 1994 elections. The game has changed. The rules have changed. The country club beltway republicans like the guys at NRO, don’t get it.

    Along with the voting game being rigged, we will, as others have pointed out, see the death of conservative talk radio. We will see the price of ammo go from 47 cents for one 9mm bullet to…….what…..$3.47? We will see massive stacking of far leftists judges on all Federal benchs who the MSM will (and has already) lied about, and called “moderates.” Who will declare all sorts of leftist agenda rules, regs, and laws which take away our freedoms, to be “constitional.” And there is not a damn thing we can do about it.

    Yeah, we can fantasize all we want about making an Alamo-like last stand. I myself have gone from never owning (or for that matter shooting) a firearm, to now owing a Remy 870 shotgun, a SW 686 .357 Magnum revolver, and a Glock 17 9mm. But that is for the civil unrest/anarchy/looting, etc. I anticipate coming. (People will not stand politely and civilly in breadlines like they did in the 1930′s). Where I live, we now have 12% unemployment. Even though we are at the height of the tourist season and the restaurants, etc., are fillled with snowbirds. Who will go home in a month.

    But I did NOT become armed in anticipation of a “civil war.” Come on. Government employee swat teams and troops obey orders. Nobody in the National Guard raised 2nd Amendment objections when they were told to go house to house in New Orleans after Katrina and confiscate all weapons. Nobody disobeyed the orders to burn those kids alive in Waco, TX; or went AWOL when ordered to seize Elian Gonzalez at gunpoint; or expressed concern and appealed to a higher commanding officer when ordered to fire on that guy holed up in Montana. Etc.

    Let’s not kid ourselves.

    Sorry for the pessimism. But I don’t see much reason for hope. Which is why, in addition to arming myself, I am also trying to recommit myself to my Faith. Yeah, I suppose Dear Leader will have to label me as one of those “Clingers.”

  68. huxley Says:

    I’m not going to say that it can’t happen here, but I don’t think it is more than a small possibility.

    Obama is not boiling the frog, he is dashing it with a scalding water. Pushback is building and he hasn’t even finished 100 days. Obama worship has peaked out. The economy is bad, but that’s in comparison to the most vibrant sustained boom in world history. We are nowhere near the economic conditions of Weimar Germany or pre-Revolution Russia or the Great Depression.

    Plus Obama and his people are not nearly as smart and competent as they think.

    Which is not to say they are not going to do some damage to the United States, but I think we are a long ways from having to man the parapets.

  69. Artfldgr Says:

    The common understanding of that term is debased in normal conversation.

    this is what i referr to when i say that they speak in codes…

    the easiest example i can pull up is their use of the word “peace”.

    we define peace as absence of war and military conflict, maybe even political conflict, but not specifically saying all politics has to be the same.

    while the socialists/communists define peace as the absence to any opposition to socialism/communism.

    therefore, like in 1984, they are in a perpetual war against everything till no one opposes this. but the fact that this makes such misery there is always someone opposed to it, and so its perpetual slavery till our genetics change under the pressure. but then, we will die off… for life without the will to life, stops.

  70. Artfldgr Says:

    “Is Obama in charge?”

    yes and no..

    as in any leadership thing, even that funky german dude, the leader is in charge in moving all the other termites, and giving them permiession to act which in effect halts a large part of the loyal population.

    however, even lenin and hitler were kind of ‘put up’ into their places… and so were not completely free to act… this changes later when these moves that are being made now create a political dependency in which they do better under despotism than they do under freedom. then when that power is consolidated and so many are dependent on the bad system, THEN he is in control.

    from that point on, he may not follow his keepers or mentors, or helpers, or what you want to call them. he has the power that can oppose them, and they usually do.

    lenin did not go gently into that goodnight
    stalin was poisoned… and on it went..

    they dont live long lives, they live exciting lives of historical purpose and imortality…

    you need a narcissist to create the populous movment to move the people to what they dont want… but like so many things in nature, the enabling thing is the destructive thing.

    that the qualities one needs are the toxin that poisons the situation. except when things are as fred is explaining, morally good. then the qualities one needs are in a positive feedback mode… but fragile.

    obama is a post turtle that owes everyone around him for his position. he does not know that what he has been taught through the doctrine of tabula rasa and manipulation, are all the wrong things.

    the left doesnt want any culture… and so obama does not understand the reasons or importants of culture, custom, power maintenence, etc.

    so he is on leno, his wife wears a tank top to see the queen, he gives back a gift (how insulting), he gives cheesy gifts.

    he is a sociopath, so culture is meaningless, and so he cant never act correctly…

    they could never put one so well dipped and marinated in the doctrines into place if we had time to see who or waht he is through his works. and so he has none…

    shows you also how vulnerable a free state is when there are totalitarian states around… the free state would do fine without the devils.. and the devils use the fact they can steal the free state to say their way is better…

    might makes right, and the clenched fist is descending…

  71. mimi sk Says:

    Artfldgr: That’s it, and so well said. Kind of leaves one with an empty feeling, though.

  72. Tom Says:

    As to SouthernJames’s point about our armed forces following orders and not pulling a Pinochet, the all-very-conservative officers I know above rank of major all agree: our military will not stand with us; they are sworn to uphold the Constitution even while Hussein perverts it.

  73. br549 Says:

    Speaking of raising cattle and the associated paperwork designed to strangle the little guy, etc. – HR875 also outlaws organic farming, which is being shoved through quickly and quietly. This bill works all the way down to growing tomatoes and peas in our own back yards.

  74. mimi sk Says:

    HR875 or not. I’ll do what I damn please with what I get out of MY own garden, thank you.

  75. FredHjr Says:

    How is it that men, who take an oath to defend the Constitution of the United States of America from all enemies, foreign and domestic, think that their oath of office is to the Commander in Chief? Nowhere in their oath are they pledged to a man or an office.

    Someone please explain this to me. I’m kind of dense.

  76. Tom Says:

    Fred:
    The sense I get is that constitutionally POTUS is CIC, thus his orders are to be obeyed, even if POTUS is violating the Constitution. Plus, the US has a long “tradition” of civilian control of our military; cf. MacArthur v. Truman.

    I also asked whether a state’s National Guard would violently suppress a civil uprising by that state’s citizens. Answer: Nat. Guard from another state would likely be brought in to suppress, so brother wouldn’t be suppressing brother.

    You are far from dense. I have come to value your comments highly.

  77. SouthernJames Says:

    Soldiers or more likely “Federal Law Enforcement” combat Swat teams, or National Guardsmen, are not going to pause and question orders given to them from above, and ponder the Constitutionality of those orders.

    I already gave one example. National Guardsmen, who are from another state, and who are flown in to New Orleans, and they are in a strange and not familiar (their own neighborhood/town) environment. They are ordered from above to go door to door – not through poor and therefore arguably more unstable neighborhoods mind you, but middle and upper middle and wealthy neighborhoods – with their loaded M-16′s….. and confiscate all firearms. By force if necessary. Under the guise of martial law, but whatever the reason – those are the orders. Clearly in violation of the Constitution they are sworn to upheld. But they are not ConLaw scholars – they are soldiers who have been given orders.

    And they follow those orders.

    And if some “Citizen’s Patriotic Tea Party Second Amendment All-American Hot Dog and Apple Pie Militia” group gathers on a street corner with their lawfully owned revolvers, pistols, and hunting rifles…..and they refuse to relinquish their weapons……how many Guardsmen do you think are REALLY going to defect and walk over to the other side? And if a shot goes off..who wins the ensuing firefight? Hmmm.

    My prediction as to what will happen with many conservatives in the military is – they will keep their heads low and their mouths shut – and they will not re-enlist. And walk away from it in disgust.

  78. FredHjr Says:

    I checked the oath. It is the exact same oath I took back in April of 1973 in Boston’s U.S. Army complex for my delayed entry for August 1973. The officers’ have essentially the same oath. The only different oath is the one taken by the National Guard. Theirs is to their governors and to the Commander in Chief, President of the United States.

    I’ve sought legal opinions about the regular Army (and other branches) oath. It is not taken to a person or to an office. There really is an “out” for orders that are unconstitutional or derive from an unlawful authority.

    As best I can determine, the likely reason why the military would not depose a government that has gone way over the line is purely mercenary. Purely mercenary. Cowardice. Lack of honor. The ranks of the officer corps are sprinkled with such men. I believe most are honorable and would, under dire circumstances, depose a tyrannical and unconstitutional government. It would, of course, have to be a clear-cut, no-brainer situation, I’ll grant you that. And that would be more than fair, in my estimation.

    The situation I’ve described is in extremis.

    Like I said, my smart money is on the fact that the current romper room is so incompetent and malodorous that they will hang themselves and reprisal will be taken at the ballot box, despite ACORN’s best RICO criminal efforts.

  79. Perfected democrat Says:

    When the Tea Partys become bigger than the Vietnam War era demonstrations, the duplicitous democrats and their shill MSM will morph back toward the center to insure the support of the shallow mainstream, and to preserve adequate political support for their position of power…

  80. Artfldgr Says:

    sorry for the empty feeling mimi…
    if i had better material to work with, you could be sure i would put it up…

    however the more i read, the worse it gets. i am now reading the details on how our ACOULTURED leader, is alienating everyone wiht the assistance of his wife.

    return a gift… how nice… (and very insulting in all the cultures that obama has been raised in other than US).

    attend the meeting with the queen in a short sleeved shirt casual.

    but the worst is what i just read.

    The rules are set in stone, and so the eagerly watching British media sputtered when the First Lady of the United States, Michelle Obama, briefly put her hand on the back of Queen Elizabeth II as the two chatted at a reception. Etiquette is quite stern about this (“Whatever you do, don’t touch the Queen!”). In 2007 John Howard, then Prime Minister of Australia, got plenty of criticism for apparently putting his arm around the Queen to direct her through a crowd. He denied actually touching her, but photographs suggest that he came quite close. (Another former Australian Prime Minister did put his hand on the Queen in a similar circumstance and was later branded “the Lizard of Oz.”)

    she WAS warned, it was in the articles leading up to the event.

    but these are culture smashers, and so they have no idea how to act… they have no idea that the reason we act in culture ways is not because we like to, or we obey nasty people, its because when we dont, others tend to think things that are not right, or untrue.

    the queen knows that much of power is image, and pomp, custom, and so forth… familiarity means the power of a queen fades… hitler knew this as did his immediate followers. when they were in favor, he let them touch his arm, or stand near him… when they fell out of favor, you can see the trying to touch him, or get close, and almost be desperate at it.

    In any case, the touch lasted just a second or two, and the Queen did not seem particularly perturbed – though she appeared slightly surprised as she drew away.

    as i see it.. he is running up the bills. giving in to our ‘enemies’ before negotiations even start. deflating the ability of the military to protect us. destroying economy which was the machine that won our wars… and to top it off… alienating the people and countries that would come to our aid if there was trouble… and making satelite countries paranoid as he sends secret messages to russians and chinese (to which they show the world his treatury outright).

    he has already poisoned the respect for the office being an acoultured clown… but the worst is yet to come.

    the worst starts when his world starts to crumble, like now, and his special organizaitons and such attempt to prevent this, and the putsch starts.

    hey fredhjr,
    its the fact of these oaths and those that take them that keeps me from writing things off as a done deal. you are right, in a real fight, the lefties would last three seconds… in fact, they would, as they did at the protests, set themselves up to be targets… the ones i worry arent the metrosexual battle class (you can see them at the end of blazing saddles when they punch the producer).

    what i worry are the 3 decades of illegals who have gone through the training of sandinistas, ms13, and many other types sharing training and such.

    FBI: Burgeoning gangs behind up to 80% of U.S. crime
    http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2009-01-29-ms13_N.htm

    when the fit hits the shan, these are the groups that have weapons, training and will.

  81. Artfldgr Says:

    The diplomatic ineptitude from the Obamination Administration just doesn’t stop. Shrieking harpy Michelle Obama has now hugged the Queen of England, committing a major faux pas that Her Majesty graciously smoothed over.

    What could be more inappropriate (other than giving the Queen a second iPod as a gift)? How about our Affirmative Action President bowing to the King of Saudi Arabia?

    the queen of england is a nothing, the saudi king is above obama… how nice.

  82. SouthernJames Says:

    I don’t think we’ll get Viet Nam results with our Tea Party protests. Again, I am detecting what I perceive to be optimism based in fantasy. Sorry – just how I see it.

    See, one difference between the Tea Parties and the Viet Nam War demonstrations will be the difference in the manner in which they have been and will be conducted. The Tea Party protesters (of which I will be one, on the 15th) will continue to consist of law abiding, patriotic Americans. So there won’t be violent clashes with police, buildings burned down – you know, the kind of crap we are seeing from the leftist sh-theads in their G-20 protests in London right now, and the kind of behavior we saw from campus sh-theads in the 60′s. This in and of itself will make the protests easier to ignore.

    A second and the biggest difference will be in the manner in which the protests are covered by the national media. Once the national media starts to cover them after they finally get too big to ignore. It will be skewed SO badly, with every possible effort to marginalize, make them seem like crackpots, just a tiny “right wing” minority, etc.

    Do not underestimate the propaganda power of the Leftist Obama-media. They played a HUGE if not the key role in turning this election into Cool American Idol versus wacky stupid Alaska hillbilly running with “Bush Third Term” McCain. For the sleeping masses who get their “news” from SNL and John Stewart – the message was pounded home like a sledgehammer. And it worked.

    Back to protests….Do you recall how much POSITIVE and sympathetic media attention was directed at the anti-war rallies – and how inflated the numbers were made to appear; and how the hateful “Bush Hitler” and the commie hammer and sickle signs, etc., somehow, magically, never made it on to the evening news; and somehow, magically, the group of counterprotesters, just across the street, with their American Flags, etc. also never seemed to catch the eye of the cameraman? [Unless THEY had a wacko or two in their midst with a white supremacy sign or something - THEN we get photos of the counterprotest].

    Nothing must get in the way of the Narrative.

    Now Flip it. Now the Counter Protestors have become the initiating protestors. Support the Troops counter-rally people morphing into Tea Party. And once our protest rallies get too big to totally ignore, Acorn and Co., will “community organize” some counter protestors. And then ……watch Pravda in action. Watch how it’s covered. Listen to how it is portrayed…..

    I’ve decided to particpate anyway. Because I want to go down fighting. Not because I have confidence in our chances of victory.

  83. FredHjr Says:

    Artfldgr,

    Neither I nor the men I know are fearful of a bunch of Central American syndico-Communists from Central America and Mexico. There are a lot more of us than there are of them. We have better discipline and training, even if many of us are long gone from the military. We have the instincts for organizing and tactics. If pushed we can be utterly ruthless, because if they start despoiling our land and our people we will be absolutely furious and our blood would be up. God help them, because we won’t give any quarter to them.

    With people who are reasonable and civilized, you can make common ground and agreements with. But with savages the likes of the brood of Sandino and other bastard offspring, you are not dealing with civilized human beings.

    I have absolutely no quarrel with any person from another country who wants to come here legally, work, and better their lives. In fact, I embrace our Latino and Hispanic brethren here who are working and being solid citizens even if they are not yet American citizens. As far as I am concerned, since they tend to be fellow Catholics, I want to help them. I see some of them in church at Mass when I go on Saturday evenings or Sunday mornings. And I fear for them when the gangs try to extort from them or some American yahoos harass them. I hope and pray their children do not fall in with these bastard sons of Sandino, Che, Fidel, and Mambo Chimp (Chavez).

  84. FredHjr Says:

    SouthernJames,

    I too will be participating in a Tea Party Protest in Manchester, NH. My only concern for that day is finding parking in the area, since it will be in an urban park.

    BTW, I remember back in 1979-80 the media really carried the water for Carter, and he still lost to Reagan. Also, the kids (I was just out of the Army then and a young Leftist who didn’t learn the lesson the vast majority of my peers did learn) where I was going to college (University of New Hampshire) voted heavily for Reagan. The Seventies were every bit as liberal as they are now and perhaps more so.

    At times I can be optimistic by nature, but mostly I am a realist. I tend to not be a pessimist by nature, which perhaps colors how I see things. I really do believe that these people who won in ’06 and ’08 are so incompetent, drunk with power, and living in a dream world that they will drive the voting public to take reprisal at the ballot box.

    When the economy starts to recover, it is going to be a weak recovery. All of us at the office where I work are in complete agreement with our in-house economist about this. And when the recovery begins, all that stored up liquidity measured by M1, M2, etc. will come pouring into the system and get inflation started. Energy prices will be soaring. If they pass cap and trade, you will have the recipe for economic problems the likes of which this nation has never seen since the 1970′s. Throw on the foreign policy faux pas and crisis template, and you get the picture. The Jimmy Carter years will be halcyon in comparison.

  85. huxley Says:

    Meanwhile the Obama pledge campaign on behalf of his budget has yielded minimal results. The DNC reported 642,000 pledges but that was inflated from 114,000. See below.

    In fact, the canvassing of Obama’s vaunted e-mail list of 13 million people resulted in just 114,000 pledges — a response rate of less than 1 percent. Workers gathered 100,000 more from street canvassing. The DNC got to 642,000 by making three photocopies of each pledge so that each signer’s senators and representative could get one.
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/04/01/AR2009040104218.html

    His Rasmussen Approval Index has dropped back to +5 after the Wagoner firing spike.

    I think Obama’s strength is only going to diminish over time. Yes, he can still wreak havoc, but we are a very long ways off from civil war.

  86. huxley Says:

    Should be “inflated from 214,000″.

  87. FredHjr Says:

    huxley,

    No argument from me about your conclusion. That’s the scenario I hope for: political resolution that throws the bums out at the ballot box. But we first have to experience a lot more pain before we get there. We have essentially two generations of Americans, Gens X and Y, who have never really experienced the failure of socialism. An entire template in their minds put there by their teachers has to be blasted to smithereens by reality.

    We will get back on track when the Left is defeated in people’s minds as well as at the ballot box.

    Friedrich Hayek’s “The Road to Serfdom” should be required reading of every college student in the country.

  88. Artfldgr Says:

    I agree with you up to a point fred…

    but the force to space ratio to move people who are intimate with the landscape out of city locations is not going to be a breeze.

    each year, like navy week, the marines come out in times square and other locations and they give their show. i have covered it several times. they allow people to sign a waiver, and fight hand to hand with the marine… I have old fashioned weapons training (before firearms :) ), and have basically whupped each one when one on one with a rifle simulacrum (dont know what they are called). last year i watched a tall thin gangbanger take on a marine i wouldnt touch (i am 6’3″ 235), and like an octopus, completely imobilized him and over the course of a a few minutes, had him red and on verge of passing out.

    i grew up in these urban places (fordham road tremont area of the bronx during the race riots of the 60s)… I live a few blogs from a famous development…

    i am not so clearly sure as you as i know the target personally. I have seen the weapons they make in prison when there is almost nothing to make weapons out of. they cant do calculus, but they sure can make everything from electric tatoo machines, to zip guns, and so forth.

    one of the most interesting i have ever seen was a t50 hand stable gun worked into a 8 round 12 guage assault rifle.

    we are just pulling out of iraq, and the iraq people are less trained than the guys of MS13… they are not as well armed… and not so well situated..

    I can see you guys just roping off the areas and letting them kill themselves rather than going in. but that would leave people like my wife and myself locked in the meat grinder.

    there is a lot of wierd stuff going on… and i only post a tiny fraction of things…

    anyone read aobut the pre-building of 30,000 new graves in the arizona national veterans cemetary?
    and of course now the civilian labor program at the army site makes a lot more sense, no?

    here is a video of them instaling the sealed containers…
    http://www.nmatv.com/video/1921/Mass-Grave-Mystery-Crews-Working-on-Crypts-for-28000-pt1

    http://www.nmatv.com/video/1922/Mass-Grave-Mystery-Crews-Working-on-Crypts-for-28000-pt2

    two bodies to a container… why double stacked?
    whats going to happen that they are going to need more than 30,000 military graves? will it be for the oldsters as they die off? will it be for the vets who get rationed med care?

    and on the give act, why did they change the word camp, to campus throughout?

    and there is a new facility in tuscon that just sprang up (maybe this is why pelosi wont let the greenies collect desert sun?) its a wackenhut thing, but they have been driving empty prison busses around and having operations but no people in them. why? are these part of the civilian labor camps they started building a couple of decades ago?

    and this is something we helped fund… its known that most of the missiles that were supposed to be destroyed never were..

    Starting in the Brezhnev period, Russia has been pursuing construction of a massive underground facility at Yamantau Mountain and the city of Mezhgorye (formerly the settlements of Beloretsk-15 and Beloretsk-16). The complex, reportedly being built by tens of thousands of workers, is said to cover an area of up to 400 square miles, the size of the Washington area inside the Beltway. The exact location of this large facility is uncertain, and given its reported size it may span as much as an entire degree of latitude and longitude.

    so from brezhnev on they ahve been building up silently like hitler did? after all, we now know that china has a missile designed to take out our aircraft carriers..

    here is a quote from a washington times article.
    The Clinton administration has been providing hundreds of millions of dollars in U.S. aid to Russia to help Moscow dismantle its nuclear arsenal. Despite the aid, the CIA report shows that the Russians are building both defensive and offensive strategic facilities and weapons, including a new type of long-range strategic missile and a new strategic missile submarine.

    Russia announces major arms buildup
    edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/europe/03/17/russia.rearmament/

    everything we know we are assuming…

    China’s arms buildup shifting balance in Asia: US report
    english.rti.org.tw/Content/GetSingleNews.aspx?ContentID=75982

    this has been going on for a long long time…

    unlike the US, their leadership are a still unbroken line from the early days. and they were aroudn when states leaders werent allowed to collude behind closed doors away from the eye of their own people…

    anyone care to comment on the SCO and CSTO? (the logo looks like obama’s)

    i am not as confident as you fred..

    i grew up with those people…
    and today, they are many times more dangerous…

    hopefully you and i will never find out the answer to it!!!

  89. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    It just keeps getting better.

    Unless Bozo the Clown is looking for a contact lens that just popped out, here for your edification is a picture of President Obama bowing to the ruler of Saudi Arabia; this sure gives the lie to all those paranoid types who said that Obama was a crypto-Muslim (http://tinyurl.com/cuo5vr).

  90. Artfldgr Says:

    PRESIDENT JOHN F KENNEDY SECRET SOCIETY SPEECH
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs5ldP6pRC4

    i guess the left forgot this… how they could imagine a link between this man, and obama is beyond me. i guess they were too stoned to actually hear.

    the kennedys were staunch anti communists
    until two were killed, then they became that which they opposed.

    “an error doesnt become a mistake till you refuse to correct it”

  91. Artfldgr Says:

    Wolla Dalbo i already mentioned that…

    among a lot of other things… :)

  92. Artfldgr Says:

    and atlas shrugs is again potentially in the works.

    the funny thing is that angelina jolie may try to play taggart… (ugh, for some reason i see that poisoning the whole thing from the get go)

    anyway…
    here is a relatively new, and AWSOME speech set to get the thinking juices flowing

    “this is john galt speaking”

    here is the playlist (it is a cut down, the original speech of galt is 50 pages long).

    http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=4BE5E347A6222400

    in this version, one can touch and finally understand how a dark age happens. the people taking control now, create it… (for them its good, its called dynasty)…

    right now i have two new tech patents being worked on. one solves the data search problem for unorganized data in a zeta byte world.. the other is new med equipment. I have a design for countering stealth technology, but refuse to put it to paper… later this month, my creative work is to be in an art show… and i just got a tiny check for a image appearing in a german magazine.. all the while, i am trying to build a company with my wife.

    so the whole Galt speech touches on me… a man who does all this, as well as works as a computer scientist… and has zero degrees….

    for me, and many others are the ones who create the things and solutions that everyone needs.

    when obama is putting money into making a green economy, he imagines that we will come and make it for him. that the details are unimportant… that we will like ants make it happen…

    if we could ahve we would have… right now, we still dont have the tech yet, nor can we force it… any more than the romans could have built a stealth fighter…. too much knowlege that needs to be amassed to a critical point.. (so dunmbing us down kissed all these hopes to fauilure 40 years ago).

    what do i do? do i stay? do i leave to another country? would another place want the technology i have and the work i have done? it hasnt been made, so there is no restriction to me…

    i always thought that eventually i would get things toether, and like the millionaires next door do ok in my 50s. now i am listening to galts speech and thinking.. maybe its better to just give up on all those things, and the same stuff i do for a fee for others…

    how many like me?
    how many will just walk away?

    my father went galt with is grand master oils, and incredible talent…

    no one wanted it… work like maplethorpe was the in thing along with socialist realism… and dad had enough of socilaism when the family fled between occupations. we have about 25 incredible paintings that everyone thinks we are very wealthy and art collectors. but no. dad painted them on things like window shades… but in various styles and mixes at will… his favorites were things like rembrandt… (he was friends at one time with the guy who was famous for faking and selling such things)… we have a copy of a rembrandt he did… incredible… as i have seen the original in a museum (dad never did)… and it was like walking into my parents living room… the only difference you could easily see was that my dad refused to fill in a spot on the canvas, forever insuring no one would scam someone…

    do i go galt? do i go to another country and work my ideas and expertise there? do i shift my work to military solutions?

    i dont know… but at least galt has one thinking..

  93. Robohobo Says:

    Neo-neocon said: “Obama has put enough cards on the table to see much of his hand.”

    Who’d a thunk it? And only 60 days into ‘The Won’s’ Imperial rule. Us rubes in flyover country got it right. We did say before the election that we believed what he actually said is what he would do. Guess what? He has acted as he said he would. Glad you Left and Right coaties can now maybe allow us hopeless hicks may have had it right.

    What are you going to do when it all comes down as it may and you need a sheepdog to protect you? Hmm?

  94. Oh, bother Says:

    I’m an out-of-work medical coder, lost my job on the leading edge of the tanking economy. Because my first husband was the charismatic type, I am immune to Obama’s charms that others were/are so taken with. In fact, he gives me the creeps. Tip: having to hide Michelle was a tell.

    Second, being out of work gave me far too much time to dig past the MSM smokescreen to find out what the Obama campaign was so anxious to hide. Call me paranoid if you like, but I spent the time between July and the election virtually paralyzed with fear that the American people would elect this Marxist. Very little of what he has done has surprised me*. His administration has to move fast to make their changes before most Americans notice.

    I have and will attend my local tea parties, although I don’t expect it to do much good. Frankly, I don’t see much help until the media can be frightened or otherwise brought to realize their future lies with those who love America, rather than those who would destroy it.

    ** Except disrespect the Queen, which I assume was done on purpose. Geez, even the State Department knows you don’t touch the Queen.

  95. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    Someone asked about my assertion about the Obama administration trying to use DOD procurement regulations to decrease the amount and increase the price of of ammunition available to the civilian market. Here is one article about this arcane maneuver (http://tinyurl.com/d2kfss).

  96. Wolla Dalbo Says:

    As seen by his actions, Obama has several key goals, his real goals—having nothing to do with the economic crisis he has declared a “disaster”–that he thinks he must attain if he and the Democrats are to stay in power and consolidate their rule; the classic moves to control elections, to quell dissent, and to form a power base of “people’s organizations,” that are the stuff of Tyranny.

    The overarching goal is to stay in power, and to insure that he and the Democrats are not voted out of office—that is going to be obtained by getting such absolute control of the Census that they can insure something like the 70 year rule of Mexico’s “Institutional Revolutionary Party,” since it is census counts that are used to create, eliminate and configure congressional districts. Obama’s first attempt, to just yank the Census function from the Commerce Department, where the Constitution places it, and lodge it in the White House under White House Chief of Staff Rehm Emanuel’s control, failed. Another attempt to gain such control via legislation has recently passed, and will give Obama ally, leftist, vote-fixing ACORN, a major role in hiring the 1.4 million census enumerators. Now, in the last few days comes the announcement that Obama has nominated a “Harvard Expert,” Robert M. Groves, to run the Census, an “expert” who is best known for his expertise in “statistical sampling.” Somehow, I think that such “sampling,” instead of a direct count, will overwhelmingly benefit Obama and the Democrats and help to keep them in power.

    Another major goal is to quell opposition—the re-imposition of the “Fairness Doctrine,” attempts to have the Department of Homeland Security’s control of Cybersecurity and, with it, the ability to disconnect parts of the Internet in an “emergency” transferred to the White House, plus initial, very stealthy attempts to change DOD procurement regulations to reduce the amount of ammunition available to civilians are steps toward attaining this goal.

    The other goal is to create a power base outside of the military—eventual passage of the GIVE Act mandating public service, the expansion and creation of a myriad of “public service” organizations with hundreds of thousands of positions and large amounts of funding, his persistent efforts to fund the corrupt leftist ACORN with hundreds of millions of tax dollars, and the vast expansion of the number of citizens who do not pay any taxes but, in fact, will be getting “tax credits’ i.e. welfare checks from the Obama administration, are all efforts toward forging such a civilian power base beholden and answerable to Obama.

  97. Mccarney Says:

    Thanks very good writing…
    ip sorgula

  98. CNC Router Says:

    CNC Router…

    [...]neo-neocon » Blog Archive » Feel overwhelmed? [continued][...]…

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About Me

Previously a lifelong Democrat, born in New York and living in New England, surrounded by liberals on all sides, I've found myself slowly but surely leaving the fold and becoming that dread thing: a neocon.
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