Home » The election of 2008: not listening to Cassandra

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The election of 2008: not listening to Cassandra — 89 Comments

  1. I’m afraid Mark Steyn has squashed my hope that those elections will really mean anything, short of a lot of Republicans getting a spine transplant.

  2. I also look on with hope when I see my home state of VA preparing to sue the federal government for this Health care bill.

    Though I voted for Palin / McCain and enthusiastically because Palin’s prescriptions for the economy is what we needed – I looked on during the inauguration with hope. I wanted Obama to be the moderate he tried to say he was during the campaign. Except for the few candid moments Obama was devoid of details and vague on purpose it seems….

  3. Its not clear if Americans understand what is happening, though I think they understand better than we think. The most likely scenario is that Republicans win in a landslide in November. But not because they show up in great numbers, rather because Democrats and Democratic leaning people won’t show up. They won’t be able to stomach voting for Republicans, but they will feel something is wrong with the progressive philosophy and decide not to participate.

    In a sense, progressives are like terrorists, though not in the literal sense. They are like them in the sense that most people don’t really think they exist. When a progressive gets elected, they realize the existence of the philosophy and correct their attitudes and actions accordingly. For a large chunk of of the electorate, that consists of stopping support by not voting.

    James

  4. And in fact, Obama has been even worse than I expected, more openly doctrinaire and less incremental, as well as more ruthless and unashamed in his Orwellian lies.

    Worse than my worst nightmare of him is the way I have put it to people.

    My ‘hope’ was that, as they said (but I never believed), he was ‘smart’ and would therefore move to the center, and so on. What he did was to sprint to the left and dig in. Now he is dug in and supplied and wreaking havoc daily. It seems that from week to week, even day to day, it gets worse in every area.

    The real hope – and major surprise – was the Tea Party movement, and the Town Hall events. Very few Republicans, with notable exceptions, were any good.

    I think we are down to the people of America, and a miracle.

    I heard Michael Medved (who is always so optimistic in the face of everything) yesterday talk about Pharaoh’s pursuing armies, and last ditch last minute miracles, and how he thinks one will happen through all this either now or in November.

    I hope he’s right. I have my doubts. Although if there is anything in this world really worth hoping for it is the kick of the American People when they are pushed.

  5. There is little, if any, evidence of being able to rely on “Moderate” Democrats to “save” any meaningful legislation–EVER. Personally, I am sadly confident that the Democrats will muster the votes necessary to pass this abomination, and it will be extremely difficult to remedy its effects in the future. The Democratic leadership has proven ready to prostitute themselves–go to any length–to buy the votes. I find it depressing that there isn’t more uproar over their shenanigans.

  6. Baklava:

    I agree that the opposition to this bill that is starting to happen at the state level may be our best hope. Can the fed overturn them. Probably but they can’t simply ignore them the way they do tea party protests, not on Capital Hill and not in the press.

  7. Check out the Drudge story on Walgreens stores in Washington State dropping drug service to new Medicaid recipients. The health care bill greatly expands the Medicaid population which will create such problems. This sort of thing along with doctors backing away from Medicare and Medicaid between now and November could wake up some of those Democrats who voted for Obama as well as Democrats in Congress.

  8. What appealed to people about Obama was that he was black… or at least half black.

    50 years of propaganda promoting the sainted virtue of black men and the evil of white men produced the expected result.

    The frenzy of “diversity” propaganda produced the expected result.

    People tend to over learn lessons. The lesson of WWII was that racial prejudice was the cause of all human suffering. Racial prejudice is now generally accepted as original sin. Eradicating original sin is salvation.

    Over learning the lessons of the past is what starts the cycle of karma back on its next repetition. The next violent nightmare of humanity will be caused by this hysterical desire to to cleanse humanity of the original sin or racial prejudice.

  9. That should read “The next violent nightmare of humanity will be caused by this hysterical desire to cleanse humanity of the original sin of racial prejudice.”

  10. In most cases, saying something is your “worst nightmare” come true is casual hyperbole. In this case, it’s no exaggeration.

    And I agree, most people aren’t paying attention, even if they have a nagging sense that things are going badly. At least few people are singing his praises or buying the Obama t-shirts anymore.

    Call me cynical, but I still think the main reason Obama’s personal approval ratings are still surprisingly strong is because many people are reluctant to state for the record that they don’t like or don’t approve of the nation’s first black president.

  11. That’s democracy for you!

    Implicit in democracy is the acceptance of government whose policies you oppose.

    It’s a bit like freedom of speech really. Freedom of speech means allowing the expression of views you despise. There’s no point in having it otherwise.

  12. Your post today confirmed the post I made late last night re: your previous post of yesterday.

    I see a lot of people waking up, but not in time, unfortunately. If the bill, let alone the Dems’ use of — more aptly, the abuse of process — does not wake them up, to use Evan Bayh’s words: There’s no waking up!

    I sincerely hope that is not the case. I both welcome, and dread the furor that passing this act should raise among the public. The dread, because this is so clearly bad for America; the hope is that people voice their true feelings: the outrage that this arrogant President dares violate our Constitution so flagrantly in the face of the American people. As I have previously said, this is no longer about instituting an idealistic – albeit wrong-headed — goal of healthcare for all controlled solely by the federal govt.

    I have become aware that Mark Levin has prepared lawsuit based on Constitutional grounds should HCR pass, as well as the unconstitutionality of mandates. I’m sure there are many suits just waiting in the wings and I hope they can’t file them fast enough. Hopefully included in the filings, will be a request for stays of any actions called for in HCR until the lawsuits are resolved.

    The outright lies, the flagrant subversion of constitutional process, the defiant attitude exhibited by the President, himself, in declaring that he doesn’t give a fig about “process.” He violates his oath to protect and defend the Constitution and the people of the U.S. and I would love to see him impeached for this. (But don’t know if this is even possible at present due to current Democratic numbers. May this be a case of “Beware of what you wish for” for the Dems — and may they suffer the consequences of the actions they now take, and the way in which they have chosen to do so!
    I have heard it said that he best thing for Obama would be to lose the healthcare battle as he would have a chance to salvage his Presidency. I agree. ( I think he has already flouted the law before wheb “repaying” the Unions for their largesse during the campaigns via the car company deals.) His arrogance will know no bounds should he win this HCR battle, but I hope and pray it will also be his undoing. I hope and pray the majority of citizens in this country realize what is happening and let their outrage be known! This man had the temerity to state during yesterday’s Brett Baer interview that the public “will know what’s in the bill once it is passed [!]” as will he. In sum, he admitted that he does not even know what is in the bill, but will sign it into law anyway. It is also clear that they have kept the bill from the people purposely until such time as it will have been signed. I very much fear what lurks in the hearts of the Democrats, let alone the unknown legislation hidden in the 2700 page monstrosity of a bill. I pray & hope the courts see the dangerous precedents that would be set should this business be allowed to stand, but am running out of optimism….

  13. Martyn of England,

    We do not have a “governement” in America the way you in the UK speak of “government” – which is as the current majority in Parliament where a government is then ‘formed’, etc.

    Our goveernment is supposed to be Constitutional. Within that, we have to accept different policies.

    Opposing Democrats is not like opposing free speech. It is like fighting for free speech; fighting for the Constitution.

    We do not have to “accept” anything from a government or anyone else. We aren’t like you over here. We rejected that model of elite, policy rule where you have ot accept what powerful people decide you will accept.

    We have a Consitution both parties are supposed to respect and adhere to.

    In America, we

  14. neo-neocon: Now we must rely on that most unlikely of bulwarks against tyranny–the moderate Democrats in the House, and the creativity and spine of the remaining Republicans in the Senate–and the possibility of righting things in the elections of 2010 and 2012.

    You forgot the possibility of war.

  15. Mike Mc. Says:

    “We do not have a “governement” in America the way you in the UK speak of …”

    Yes I know – but couldn’t think of a universal term and keep it concise.

  16. Mike Mc

    For ‘government’ read ‘administration’ if you prefer. I’m sure you get my point.

  17. M,

    An administration in this country is not a dictatorship.

    You need to have the votes and the process needs to be followed and the bills need to be constitutional.

    Subversion of the process is not ok.

    Bribing senators and representatives is not ok.

    We will fight the tyranny.

    You might like tyranny. We don’t.

  18. This is a very civil site. I’ve long enjoyed the thoughtful posts. The tension I see here suggests that disagreements elswhere will be quite a bit sharper.

  19. “I realize that it was always too late once Obama threw his hat into the ring (unless you go back decades, before the Gramscian march of leftism through the schools and the press). ”

    We also have to get back to teaching about econ, history, and the constitution… So when the next generation hears a future Obama talking they’ll know he is full of BS….

  20. James Says:

    “In a sense, progressives are like terrorists, though not in the literal sense. They are like them in the sense that most people don’t really think they exist.”

    That’s a very important point although the terrorist analogy doesn’t work / draws away from the point. No one really believes there are still totalitarian ideologues running amok… especially not here in the US. Trying to explain that leftists, like Obama, who use moderate language, are really extremist ideologues just makes us sound crazy. We get lumped in with the leftists who call everyone they don’t like right wing and fascists.

  21. The Democrats are on the verge of becoming anti-American royalists who “deem” legislation into existence. In America, we vote! If they go through with this, they will deserve oblivion at the polls. The best case scenario would be historic losses, fewer than 100 dems in Congress, with a large contingent of Tea Party affiliated politicians voted in. Then–again, this is best case dreaming–the Supreme Court overturns ObamaCare as unconstitutional. Yet that ruling doesn’t help the Democrats, and the party disintegrates like the Whigs did, like the No Nothings did. Again, this is a best case fantasy.

    The reality will probably be far less sunny: the permanent decline of America, European-style unemployment, more and more govt regulation, and higher taxes. Violators and opponents of this fascist “we deem, we don’t need to vote” American govt will be deemed “enemies of the state.” And you know who the classic “enemy of the state” is, don’t you? The democrats are on the verge of creating American Fascism. Thomas Jefferson is rolling in his grave.

  22. Baklava, Idaho is also preparing a lawsuit over Obamacare. I wonder how many other states legislaturers will find ways to retaliate against this president.

    My own observations about Obama before his election were 1) the guy was stupid as hell 2) he had serious and disturbing delusions of grandeur, i.e. he’s nuts, 3) he was utterly lacking in character, 4) all of the above are glaringly obvious so what the hell is happening?

    Anyway, those immortal words of Brian the dog (re The Family Guy) after Peter Griffin hunt himself after turning the stairs in to a water slide will hopefully also apply to the American electorate , “this way he’ll learn”.

    Perhaps I am being overly optimistic.

  23. I grew up in a household in which … dramatic … things happened behind the scenes. Maybe as a result: I like drama. I like danger, risk, adrenaline. It feels like a true and rich experience of life. And, so, many times, I am never happier than when my (and my friends) backs are to the wall, never happier than when we are truly pressed – than when authentic and significant risk is present.

    Many people feel hemmed in by this type situation – maybe even feel as if they are choking on clouds of dusty oppressive doom or something. I feel as if I can finally breathe free, as if I am released from horse manure tiny concerns, and can focus on and endeavor over something truly significant – as if I take a deep breath of cool clean air: ahhhhh … yeessss … this is what I like in life.

    And, maybe b/c of this predilection, b/c of this quirk in my personality, I now feel, about our national situation, as Gene the head of Mission Control felt in the movie “Apollo 13”: I believe this is our finest hour. I feel optimistic; almost eager. The left has been shoving the nation backwards for over half a century. The nation is now digging our heels into the dirt. Think of the movie “300”, when the initial Persian attack took place at the hot gates: the Persian attackers slammed into 300 Spartans, shoving the Spartans into a 300 man backward slide on the dirt… until the Spartans, digging in their heels, finally quelled the slide and brought the Persian momentum to a dead halt … whereupon the Spartans began decimating the Persian attackers.

    This is where our nation is now: we are 300 Spartans digging in our heels, and we have just … about … stopped the unstoppable leftist momentum, and we are just about to begin decimating a political left which has been shoving us backwards for 70 years. I am fired up! THIS is one of the moments I enjoy! THIS is one of the moments to savor! America is 300 Spartans, and the rest of the world is Greece. The world will watch us stand against leftism and for freedom, and the world will be inspired to do the same. This is a moment. Just as surely as Reagan saying “evil empire”, and walking out of Reykjavik, and saying “tear down this wall”, and in the end prevailing: this is a moment when we dig in our heels, begin to decimate the enemy, and in the end prevail. Wolverines!

    William A. Jacobsen:

    Regardless of [healthcare] outcome, these have been some of our finest hours.

    From the Tea Parties which sprang to life last April, to the townhalls over the summer, to the voters in Virginia, New Jersey and Massachusetts, tens of millions of Americans have done their best to stop this power grab.

    Republicans in Congress also deserve credit. Against insurmountable numerical odds, they have stuck together and thereby forced Democrats to confront their own divisions.

    Republicans from Eric Cantor to John Boehner to Paul Ryan to Mitch McConnell to John McCain to Scott Brown have given voice to the reality that Obamacare is not about health care, it is about government control over our lives accomplished through budget gimmicks which mask the truth that we cannot afford what Obama is selling.

    The nation made an historic error in November 2008. Now we are dealing with the consequences.

  24. Baklava Says:

    “I agree Thomas.”

    I’ll add that I’m not even making any out there arguments (I’m not saying things about enabling acts or ruining the economy on purpose to take over the government)…

    I get it just trying to explain the Democrats have ideological goals they are not upfront about… like forced equality (re: part of the reason insurance sold on the exchange has to be uniform)… or that they tend to think part of problem with healthcare is it involves profit and that it would be better systemically if profit motives were removed… But I live in SF and that’s what all the lefties say… themselves… all the time…

    Anyway, it’s a problem when you can’t even explain their actual motives… taken from their own words… without moderates thinking your a nut.

  25. I hear ya.

    There are some conversations with the intent to persuade.

    There are other conversations though that are fun though very serious banter about what in the world is going on.

    As we truly are here scratching our heads about how the “bi-partisan” health care summit went 2 weeks ago and how the processes can be subverted with this huge bill and what the motives could be ….

    While I have converted an African American in 1999 and he did not vote for Obama and I know persuasion can happen – not all discussions are intended to do that.

    There are the percentage of population that are truly apathetic about the policies and issues but do hear by peripheral senses about the personalities…

    The tea partiers are hyper aware and are following the news every day.

    They themselves are aware of how they are being portrayed but can do NOTHING to stop how they are being portrayed. The media will find the lunatic in the crowd.

    There is one thing on our side:
    I remember when I started seeking alternative information

    It was WHEN there was something MAJOR going on and I couldn’t WAIT for the nightly news cast. I ended up turning to AM radio.

    This year it seems that there are many MAJOR events that have more people tuning in.

    That is good for us.

    When people see alternative view points – they will consider it unless their name is Mitsu.

  26. gcotharn: times that try men’s (and women’s!) souls. But exciting times as well.

    I guess it’s what the Chinese call “interesting” times.

  27. Martyn: more than an ocean separates us and England. We left. You stayed. That’s true not just of us and England, but of us and the continent of Europe and beyond. Americans have a stronger heritage of valuing liberty. We do not blindly follow; we question, and we retain the right to follow the words of the Declaration of Independence if need be.

    And by the way, America is not a democracy. It is a republic. There’s a difference.

  28. Martyn of England Says:

    Laws passed illegally and/or that violate the constitution do not have to be followed. They have to be resisted.

  29. How is it that 53% of Americans weren’t just wrong, but terribly wrong? I’d have to chalk it up mostly to an 8 year media campaign telling people how awful the United States was under GWB who represented the status quo that had to change.

    In a trade, millions of Americans chose the risk of being much worse off, for the feel good relief of the media not telling them how rotten of a country they were a part of. And for all the Americans who couldn’t name their congressman or senator if their life depended on it, they’re mostly feeling pretty good right now, as their country turns into a central planning hell hole, but are being told through pop culture media that alls well and the world loves them again.

  30. Baklava Says:

    “When people see alternative view points – they will consider it unless their name is Mitsu.”

    True… although we have a lot more mouth foamers now than the 80s… which doesn’t help.

  31. etabby I agree with you. the Democrats do not deserve to be a mainstream party if this the type of game they play.

    Don’t rule fantasies, look what happened in Massachusetts.

  32. gcotharn,
    It’s scary for me only because I’ve seen this before and it didn’t end well, but I too am disposed to fighting.

    I hope the American people is still the people I wanted to and did join. I hope we’re still fighters.

    Let their arrows obscure the sun, we shall fight in the shade. Teach your children well.

  33. SteveH Says:

    “How is it that 53% of Americans weren’t just wrong, but terribly wrong? I’d have to chalk it up mostly to an 8 year media campaign telling people how awful the United States was under GWB who represented the status quo that had to change.”

    Everyone had been bashing republicans for years and no one responded to many of the charges… Republicans are uncool, bejesus nuts, anti science, who hate gays, blaw blaw blaw… I’ve disarmed a lot of moderates with ease just by introducing them to the other side’s POV. Demand specifics then, ‘but what about x’…. poof… lefty argument is destroyed…

    Then there is lack of education. 18-22 year olds were not taught about how lefty econ experiements failed all these times they were tried in the past… and the left blamed conservatives for all the bad things that happened socially over the last 100 years (even the things they caused)…

    All in all, I’m surprised we are not worse off….

  34. And in fact, Obama has been even worse than I expected, more openly doctrinaire and less incremental, as well as more ruthless and unashamed in his Orwellian lies.

    He’s every bit as bad as I had feared. I’d hoped I was wrong, and in the first month or two of his administration felt a flicker of hope that that was the case, but the flicker has been extinguished.

    What appealed to people about Obama was that he was black… or at least half black. 50 years of propaganda promoting the sainted virtue of black men and the evil of white men produced the expected result.

    My own observations about Obama before his election were 1) the guy was stupid as hell 2) he had serious and disturbing delusions of grandeur, i.e. he’s nuts, 3) he was utterly lacking in character, 4) all of the above are glaringly obvious so what the hell is happening?

    Obama is the Reds’ answer to Milli Vanilli. It’s easy to imagine Soros and the comrades in conclave deciding that they needed a plausible black man to use as a stalking horse, a “clean and articulate” spokesmodel who can read off a telemprompter without a trace of “Negro dialect.” The cadre can then use him to mobilize the useful idiots who yearn to prove that they’re not racist and that they “care” about the downtrodden.

    If the spokesmodel succeeds in implementing socialism, great — they’ll put him on the Kerensky plan and shove him aside. If he fails, they can attribute his failure to racism and use it as agitprop. Win-win.

  35. Martyn of England,

    I take your point, but Neo is also onto something about the difference between the U.S. and Europe. Obama and the Dems really like your system better. They want to make America more ‘European’.

    In the English Parliament all of the underhanded ‘parliamentary’ maneuvers they are trying or talking about now are scored as ‘well done; good show’. In America we see them as usurpations and instances of tyranny.

    We are not as much like any European government as Europeans think. I lived in the UK for 3 years and I know they don’t get what we do over here all the time.

  36. There is via instapundit (never thought I’d be forwarding anything said by Howard Stern):

    “The Dems Are Communists” — Howard Stern
    Home – by BigFurHat – March 16, 2010 – 20:42 America/Chicago – 40 Comments

    When you lose Howard Stern you’ve lost ordinary, everyday people. Politically, Stern is left-center to left-leaning and casually to moderately well-informed. He is done with democrats. He now sees them as communists. Many of his listeners will follow his lead.

    Thank you to Ilario Pantano for pointing to this clip. Mr. Pantano is running for Congress in the 7th District of North Carolina.

  37. Neo, you put your finger on exactly what I’ve been feeling for the past year and a half. I felt such a sense of dread after Obama was elected, and unfortunately he has indeed turned out to be even worse than I expected. One difficult thing for me was watching my students (I am a college teacher) falling for the propaganda barrage while thinking that they were thinking things through and doing their homework on the issues! Years of liberal groupthink have eroded their ability to see clearly.

  38. Well said, Neo.

    When Obama said he sat in Reverend Wright’s church — a black liberation theology church — for 20 years but wasn’t aware of Wright’s racist, anti-American rants, I knew without a doubt Obama was a dishonet man. We had a choice between a third generation naval academny honest war hero and a dishonest radical we knew very little about, and we elected the dishonest radical. I’ll never understand why.

    American voters made a huge mistake in November 2008. And with Obama’s approval ratings still in the 40%+ range, many people still haven’t come to grips with how big a mistake they made. I just hope enough people wake up by November so he can be neutralized.

  39. Some of the moderates and moderate Lefties beginning to grasp reality a bit firmer than they have before . The first stage is denial: “What! You say Obama is a power-hungry, lying, underhanded far-Left radical? Just because he broke a promise not to accept private campaign donations? Just because he was buddy-buddy with Bill Ayers? Just because the idiotic Rev. Wright was his long-time spiritual advisor? Just because he threw his own grandmother under the bus? Just because he wants to redistribute income, a Marxist idea, etc. etc.

    Some are now entering into the second stage, the If Only Stalin Knew Stage. Here’s David Brooks:

    … government is more fundamentally messed up than ever in my lifetime. Barack Obama campaigned offering a new era of sane government. And I believe he would do it if he had the chance. But he has been so sucked into the system that now he stands by while House Speaker Nancy Pelosi talks about passing health care via “deem and pass” – a tricky legislative device in which things get passed without members having the honor or the guts to stand up and vote for it.

    Ah, yes … the suck of the “system” and that witch Pelosi are ruining Obama’s Presidency. If only Stalin knew. As they say in Iraq: “Embrace the suck.”

    http://tinyurl.com/y8vx2cl

    And Howard Stern, an entertainer I’ve never paid much attention to but who apparently has in the past voted for some Democrats has been transported by an adverse FCC decision into one of the later stages of Obama Regret. He mentions Clinton, Gore and Kerry as candidates he’s backed — “I’ll never vote for another Democrat again …” Howard has just now realized that there are some Democrats on the FCC who are actually, hold on to your hats and fasten your seatbelts … (sharp intake of breath) … Communists. My, my.

    http://tinyurl.com/yaenl5y

    Perhaps, Neo, a psychologist, could formulate the various stages of Coming To Grips With the Reality of Obama. That would be fun to read.

  40. Theres also the chance with Obama like most other radical black activist, where they WANT to incite disgust and even hatred toward themselves. The last thing those in that category want is to lose their position of perpetual victimhood by screwing up and allowing harmony among differing races.

    20 years in a black liberation theology church lays the odds at 97% that hes in that category.

  41. I remember that I said what Obama was without a doubt from day one when his name was mentioned and I had read only a page or so in a quick search.

    The issue in this has always been one of education, or rather lack of it.

    While there are exceptions, the one with less experience tends to fail and have costly errors and mistakes (an exception would be Hershey’s chocolate company).

    So a man experienced in horses, will know what to look for when examining.

    Another man (or woman), without experience, might get lucky, but not in competition with those that know more and make better choices.

    Our culture has been spending a long time, like a pedophile or pederast, ‘grooming’ their victims. They have actually done many of the same things. Entanglements, lies, separate them from others, pretend they understand, pretend to be a friend, hide things that would negate this, fluff up the other, etc.

    Then train them in not being able to conclude anything without a guide. In the past, people could conclude who was right in a debate. They could weight facts, they could examine positions, and they could make a conclusion.

    They will not defer to experts the experience (as far as setting base facts), and give experience a higher informational credibility. They fill in the gaps with imagination, hearsay, rumor, and put it on equal footing with facts. Even worse, under post modernisms ideals, they want the truth to be entertaining, something lies fine easier to be (having not the limitation being imposed by reality).

    They believe they are mostly omniscient. They know everything, will not admit they don’t know something, they will not back out when they find they are wrong, they will use infinity to counter any point that would lead them to conclude, or they throw the point away and claim irrelevancy, killing any debate because every debate they throw away the variables, then say you havent proved it.

    Thomass Says:
    We also have to get back to teaching about econ, history, and the constitution… So when the next generation hears a future Obama talking they’ll know he is full of BS….

    Ho ho, haaaaa! That’s so funny that my eyes are tearing up!!!!

    The reason is that that is what I have been trying to do since before the election.

    No one has been able to argue against my facts. They have only been able to discard the conclusions out of hand not realizing that I have lots more facts, and that I can’t put up because everyone complains that what I do put up is too long!

    So I tend to put up about 1%, am told it’s too much so they don’t read it
    Then I put up .5% and they read it, but they say it doesn’t prove my point

    Abridge a prosecutor’s case to 2% of what he has as evidence and let me know what you get too.

    Thomass, how many of the free books I linked to have you downloaded and read?
    How many of the papers have you read that I linked to?
    How much of the history I put up did you go and try to fill in what I couldn’t?

    Who stuck up for me and helped me get this information out?

    My WHOLE REASON for keep coming up with uncomfortable facts, from even before the election was to teach anyone that I could so that they would see what Obama was signaling others that he was going to do.

    THIS is what got me motivated… for the first time, a president was using all the code words, contact phrases, and such in his speeches. Of course if you didn’t know these things and how they worked, you would not pick up on them.

    You become a person in the audience who doesn’t understand why an experienced judge picks one dog breed over another dog breed. He doesn’t follow your selections, and so the ignorant call him stupid rather than call themselves stupid and go out and try to remedy the condition!

    Your watching a game of cards or a board game, and you don’t know the rules, what the goals are and so you don’t understand the plays, you don’t understand why do that, not that. but again, everyone says the players must be stupid (despite their knowing what they are doing and succeeding) and the watchers are smart. None go out to find out the rules and goals and tries to bring some understanding.

    Even worse, when a person who DOES know the game comes up. They don’t want him to appear taller than them, so they cut down the tall poppy so everyone in the room can be on equal footing making up something (cause that’s more fun than the party pooper who keeps saying they are wrong, and tries to show them). they are confused, angry, their world is shaking and they cant get a handle on it.

    And here I come telling them that this is what they have been doing for decades. That all the problems are because of the things they were taught to like, and that they have to now learn and invest time that they though they had already invested in childhood.

    Do they ever learn the game? Nope. But they are subjected to the outcomes of the game and unlike a card game, they are critical in the outcomes of the game. That is until the game has moved beyond a point where they are not needed and the card players can continue without them.

    Thomass in order for them to learn, they will have to listen. And they will have to debate with the possibility that they will lose most debates in the beginning if not all of them. That the methods and things they use to decide, have to be examined as some of the tools in the box are faulty and give bad readings. (Using like and dislike or entertainment value, or size are a few of those bad tools).

    We have all been told we are equal, meaning the same, and that talent, ability and such doesn’t exist. Our conscious may or may not agree with it, but the evidence is in the behavior, not the consciousnesses opinion of itself. The behavior shows that this mentality has been internalized, and the coded response has been fixed, and so if any one tries to out distance the collective, the response is indignation and attack. And they cut down the tall poppy. Others watch, rather than defend.

    I tried to show you guys what we are doing to each other and how that is causing things.

    I put up a barney miller episode.. Where a ‘C’ student in physics made a nuclear bomb sans fissionable material. Two great lines in the show. One where the bomb squad captain says it’s not a bomb, cant be. Etc. and then Dietrich walks out of the bathroom and with barely a glance asks “where did you get the nuclear bomb”?

    And yet no one got that something so massively destructive could not be recognized for what it was.

    And that a person with some knowledge and experience all the others doesn’t have, could tell what it was at a glance.

    EVERY method I used I reformed the challenge. I tried to be blunt. Was told that that made me a pompous ass. Then I tried to be short. But then I couldn’t prove a point. I went to long, but that wasn’t entertaining, and on it went.

    But what no one got after almost two years was that every method I went to, changed to, etc… was negated by some silly thing. too long, too short.

    It was like trying to teach goldilocks and not having things just right.

    But in truth, where is the real burden between the knowledgeable and the ignorant?
    There is none… which is why society leaves the ignorant to rot.

    Never try to teach a pig to sing
    It frustrates you and really pisses off the pig

    The second great line from the show is later.

    They decide to confiscate the nuclear weapon. There is a series of jokes about how Nazis and communists were working for out government (as the German scientist kept slipping into the rules of the old regime).

    But as the student was walking out of the room, it was what he said that mattered.

    He said…
    “I was getting a C and that’s what I did to get extra credit. Imagine what the guys who get As can do when they are really pissed off?”

    And that’s why in the 60s we went from adoring smart people to abusing them.
    It facilitated the progressives need to dominate the intelligent class, and deny the common man the help that such could give. The few that didn’t join them, went the way of my family back in Europe.

    We alienated them and drove them into the hands of progressivism, socialism communism etc… and when they got to the camp, those others saw their value if they could get them and got them by love bombing them. giving them a place, some respect, listened to, a home when the society they love kicked them out. is it really so hard to understand their spite? And they trained the common man to be like a sheep dog and drive the capable, the able and such to be driven to serve them (sort of), and they endeavored to make crippled people which made it easier to drive them.
    Just as the socialists drive the economically capable to other places.

    The idea is as old as Shakespeare…
    http://www.enotes.com/richard-3-text/act-scene-1

    instead of mounting barbed steeds
    To fright the souls of fearful adversaries,–
    He capers nimbly in a lady’s chamber
    To the lascivious pleasing of a lute.
    But I,–that am not shap’d for sportive tricks,
    Nor made to court an amorous looking-glass;
    I, that am rudely stamp’d, and want love’s majesty
    To strut before a wanton ambling nymph;
    I, that am curtail’d of this fair proportion,
    Cheated of feature by dissembling nature,
    Deform’d, unfinish’d, sent before my time
    Into this breathing world scarce half made up,
    And that so lamely and unfashionable
    That dogs bark at me as I halt by them;–
    Why, I, in this weak piping time of peace,
    Have no delight to pass away the time,
    Unless to spy my shadow in the sun,
    And descant on mine own deformity:
    And therefore,–since I cannot prove a lover,
    To entertain these fair well-spoken days,–
    I am determined to prove a villain,
    And hate the idle pleasures of these days.

    Plots have I laid, inductions dangerous,
    By drunken prophecies, libels, and dreams,
    To set my brother Clarence and the king
    In deadly hate the one against the other:
    And if King Edward be as true and just
    As I am subtle, false, and treacherous,
    This day should Clarence closely be mew’d up,–
    About a prophecy which says that G
    Of Edward’s heirs the murderer shall be.

    Being kicked out, they are driven to spite.

    Another point to get..

    If they win, there will not be another chance to educate so it doesn’t happen again

    That’s the WHOLE desperate point… and why they are making the grab

    They get that brass ring… that’s it…

    As I said, ever play someone who after you have checkmate tries to show you all the neat ways he would have beaten you if it wasn’t check mate?

    Well, that’s a person that doesn’t understand that he NEVER had those ways or any chance of them. he was not beating the actual opponent, as that person won before he could act or plan, or understand what happened.

  42. I men this almost literally. He was the “American Idol” candidate. Popularity trumped all else and the election was almost the culmination of voting for your favorite performer. The emotional investment of the electorate surpassed all reason and evidence.

    Sadly his disaster of an administration will do nothing to prevent a similar thin happenning again in the future.

  43. Then, he was the anti-Bush and that’s all that mattered.

    Now, he is akin to the anti-Christ and we are all in a hell of a mess.

  44. Artfldgr, why do you look at other posters in this room and assume they are in dire need of your unquestionable facts and wisdom? The irony of ironies lies in how that part of your personality is exactly what you appear to be warning people to be on the lookout out for. WTF?

  45. I too watched the 2008 election with mounting trepidation. Unfortunately, I made it even worse for myself.

    I had a copy of The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich on my shelf for about a decade, and in early 2008 I yielded to the nudge to finally read all about how Hitler twisted democratic processes to rise to power. Obama’s techniques are out of the same playbook, especially the ad hominem attacks on Sarah Palin (straight out of Mein Kampf). For awhile I said “Well, at least we don’t have any Brownshirts about”, but then the SEIU goons started showing up at the Town Hall meetings.

    A little knowledge can be a depressing thing, but it can also be a call to action.

  46. Ha, Steve Duchame, you are even more right than you know about the American Idol comparison. Frankly, a good bit of Obama’s success came from having that amazing voice. To the casual listener, he sounds reasonable inspite of what the words he utters really mean.

  47. Adolph Hitler:
    “All propaganda has to be popular and has to accommodate itself to the comprehension of the least intelligent of those whom it seeks to reach.”

    “The broad masses of a population are more amenable to the appeal of rhetoric that to any other force.”

    Joseph Stalin:
    “Education is a weapon whose effects depend on who holds it in his hands and at whom it is aimed.”

    My point is not to compare this administration to the regimes and atrocities commited by Stalin and Hitler but more to point out the very tactics of propoganda those dictators used in media and education to further Communism and Fascism are in play now to further a Socialist agenda.

    As pointed out in so many different available sources the freedoms granted to citizens by the Constitution applies equally to Citizen’s wanting to preserve, or destroy, the uniqueness of this republic. The onslaught against the Constitution and individual freedom has been ongoing since Lenin and the birth of Communism, and the seeds of Socialism, or social justice, are firmly planted in our institutions of higher education where they are distributed freely to any and all who will give the least bit of creedence to it.

    Add to this metastasis the leftist leaning of most mainstream media outlets, and the willingness of many people to take the predigested gruel MSM dishes out as gospel, and you have the makings of our situation today.

    With the push to plant the government teat firmly in the mouth of the public my fear is that we will be hard pressed to wean off it and end up choking on swill. Given enough education, marketing and media exposure I suppose swill can be made appetizing to those who can get nothing else.

    Without an equal measure of planning and organization from the conservative movement (don’t mistake this for “Republican”) to counter what the left has put into getting this administration in place I’m afraid we have to prepare to open wide.

  48. why do you look at other posters in this room and assume they are in dire need of your unquestionable facts and wisdom?

    easy…

    take some time to go through the posts. they keep saying the same things, they come up with nothing, claim its stupidity, and then start the process in a circle again.

    if i bring up that there is a plan for this, there are books writing about the plan. papers, policy stuff. history.

    ever know more about a subject than someone else who is doesnt know, and you know it.

    thats what i feel all the time here, but if your careful and you pay attention there are several people i never say stuff to, or much at all.

    why is that?

    well i know for a fact occam went out and read one of the things that i put up. he thought i was wrong and he went back and sure enough, he just forgot what was trivial when he read it.

    The irony of ironies lies in how that part of your personality is exactly what you appear to be warning people to be on the lookout out for.

    ah… that may appear to someone who doesn’t make fine distinctions.. but if you do, you will notice that unlike most, my posts come with references, links, checks.

    and that almost no one challenges me on facts that are wrong, they only challenge my conclusions from a point of less knowing.

    bottom line.. either you know something or you dont

    your not going to beat or best people who have been plodding along in the last stage of a plan whose first phase was 60 years long..

    i can give a test..

    the left has a protest thing called winter soldier..

    i kewpie doll if you know why they called it winter soldier, and what historical figure did they invert the words of?

    i can give DOZENS of key questions that ALL lead to the answers they seek, or at least knowledge that gets them to understand things.

    but almost none of them will actually know the answers.. and none of them will admit they dont know, they will instead pretend.

    what is the sound of one hand clapping.
    do you know the REAL answer?

    which came first, chicken or the egg
    did you know that there IS a real answer to it and explanation?

    if a tree falls in the forest and there is no one there to hear it, does it make a sound.

    the answer is NO… can you tell me why?

    i NEVER tell you to trust me and not look up my source. i ALWAYS tell you to double check me. and i ALWAYS want to know if you found something contrary.

    how do you think i know so much, that’s my process. constant kaizen in everything. constant learning, correcting, learning. never stops.

    DO NOT TRUST ME!!!

    TRUST YOURSELF and get used to checking things.

    after a while there will be people you can trust MORE, but never people you can trust 100%. if you do that they will always let you down someplace, and the problem is not them, its unreal expectations.

    so does that make the distinction clearer?

    i may sound like the intelligentsia, as they are posers and cargo cultists who basically act like really intelligent people, but there is a big difference.

    i love it when you check on my stuff

    they HATE it when you check on their stuff

    why?

    because theirs is potemkin, the semblence of something, and if you get too close, question it, and not just accept it, they are busted.

    ALL of this in the past 50 years could not have happened without people refusing to check on people and refusing to hold liars to the coals, and seek others.

    in a way, they are getting what they asked for
    but in truth, they were told what question to ask

  49. WindRider,
    you should go back through the posts and see how many times i said they are copying (and that they are not original, and really smart. but smart enough to learn from history and categorize something as harmful, or good, and think how can that work for me)

    heck… the feminists copied hitler with the disparate outcomes argument (it was called something different then). its the only way to get good people to hate.

    that is get them to think they are cheated.

    [in case anyone hasnt noticed, thats almost their whole psy ops program]

    this is why they say they really know history.

    we think knowing history is knowing the dates of the big stuff, but they think knowing history the way i do, operationally, as a scientific log book of actoins and outcomes and methods.

    in such a view, the number of states america has doesnt matter so who cares. but, instead focus on how to unseat a meritocritous opponent who (they think) was ‘lucky’ enough to claim the valid moral side of an issue before they could…

    see, its the difference of whether your looking at history as an interesting movie that gives you context.

    or as a training manual where each move is one or another towards power.

    and why would one do this? because in the game of survival of the fittest, inst the easiest way to win, to convince everyone else not to compete?

    anyway… they are following hitler to a big T because hitlers path to power did not require something as magical as the latvian rifle corpsmen…

    AND the other thing is that hitler and those guys were also copying the progressives here in america.

    this is why its so hard to see it, because when the progressives printed their stuff, they didnt print how they were going to get there, and so others went off and tried to get their faster. and the american progressives helped them.

    in a way, they used the rest of the world as a laboratory to know how to catch the big fish they wanted, which if not done right, would be as Hirahito said about sleeping tigers.

    thing is, we are like a drunk man with anger on, about to go up against ju jitsu and have no idea what that is. and everyone is pretty much saying they are not so tough, we are tougher, look how tiny they are and how massive we are, etc…

    i said have more respect for your opponents…

    if they are good, you will not hurt as you would otherwise.

    and if they are bad and easily defeated, your respect offers the ability to extend a hand, and again, you will not hurt as you would otherwise.

    just some tit bits.

  50. We are seeing the worst time of our lives, unless we are old enough to have lived during WWII.

  51. Any comments from more learned souls than myself about the feasibility of launching the mother of all class action lawsuits against the Dems for fraud and racketeering might be? Just wondering…

  52. the freedoms granted to citizens by the Constitution applies equally to Citizen’s wanting to preserve, or destroy, the uniqueness of this republic.

    sorry.. constitution does not grant ANY freedoms.

    which is why Obama and others say its a restrictive document. it restricts the state from taking away the rights you always have and do not have to be given.

    telling us we cant eat a certain type of oil is a in direct contradiction to that ideal as are a lot of stuff we have accepted.

    we have accepted it because we are attempting to break out of a older mankind and the throwbacks are trying to return things. (remember they talk 180degrees)

    the future is not technological despotism..

    capitalism and its ability to seed the solar system and beyond is our future.

    all other types of state seek to enclose, steer and control…

    the nihilists are right… there is no purpose to our existence other than to exist. the nihilists are wrong, in that we ourselves find purpose by existing naturally, following our own way to meander the universe as we will.

    this creates the interesting philosophical and real notion in that your real choices in the universe is a moving through it unhindered, or being caged up in a nutshell and believing your in infinite space (cause thats what they keep telling you)

    That by guiding that which is not made to be guided, you don’t take us somewhere faster, you take us nowhere slower.

    control is impedance, and a system that is impeded is slower… and since there is no where to go, but where we meander to and live, they cant be taking us somewhere, so they are taking us nowhere.

    Nowhere slower, while claiming they are taking us someplace (better) faster.

    and since this is reality and they inverted the reality, it reinverts back for balance and delivers someplace worse faster…

    [if there is no real purpose or future, then it doesnt matter where we go or how fast we get there. and so, the fast change dont study flip the dials method of going nowhere faster, always leads to worse]

    sorry.. sometimes i get philosophical.
    i will put the Gurda down…

  53. I said it before the election and I’ll say it again: we had the choice of a bad President and an appalling one, and we chose the latter.

    Sadly, it appears that we chose him based on the color of his skin, not the content of his character.

    Not a week goes by when I don’t have to recalibrate my notions of just how bad it could be, when he — in cahoots with the worst Congressional leadership I can remember — does something that appalls me just a little bit more.

    My wife and I together make right in the $100-150K range, and I’m seriously worried if we’re going to be able to make ends meet in a year, what with the end of the “Bush” tax cuts and the inevitable new taxes and mandates coming down the pike. I can hope for a Republican-Tea Party landslide in November, but I know just how difficult it is for Congress to repeal anything, and besides we’re stuck with Obama for another three years.

    What is to be done?

  54. What is to be done?

    An unfortunate choice of title, given its previous usage by Chernyshevsky and Lenin.

  55. I have been told not to discuss politics with my liberal relations.
    If I say the sun rises in the east, it’s dismissed with a disgusting glottal noise as a conservative fiction.

    It is interesting seeing them discuss politics among themselves and if the subject isn’t the awfulness of conservatives, it sometimes comes into contact with the real world. Things get uncomfortable then.

    Gloat.

    Unfortunately, it will take more than gloating….

    I have some friends, children of friends, who demonstrate to a perfection the lack of ability to think clearly. If they want it to be so, it is. People who say it isn’t aren’t wrong on the facts, they are mean. And you don’t have to pay attention to mean people.

    With some of these folks, it’s like shooting BBs at a bowling ball, with the difference that the defensive mechanisms are so clear.

  56. In no way do I defend Obama, but:

    Recall that McCain had inched into the lead when the financial crisis broke. He lost his composure and (IMHO) threw away the election. Although his POW conduct was heroic, the Navy was proven correct to not have advanced him to flag rank.

    Afaic the last time both candidates were qualified to hold the Presidency was 1996. Worse, afaic, neither Bush, Gore, Kerry, McCain, nor Obama had what it takes.

    Yes, Obama is horrendous, but the problems with our political system go well beyond Obama. Arguably he is merely a (very serious) symptom.

  57. O.B.,

    I’m intrigued by your comparison of Obama with Kerensky. The problem is, as I understand it (and I’m no expert on these matters), that Kerensky was a lot less of a true believer than Obama is. Not that anyone can’t be turned into a place-holder, or a mid-way stepping stone. But Obama doesn’t strike me that way. He seems to see himself, and others seem to see him, as the “Giant Step” Simon says to take.

  58. Winter Soldier form Wikipedia:
    Captain America’s side kick after being supposedly killed and then revived by soviets:
    After the plane explodes, General Vasily Karpov and the crew of a Russian patrol submarine find Bucky’s cold-preserved body, minus one arm. Bucky is revived in Moscow, though, as a result of the explosion, he suffers brain damage with amnesia. Scientists attach a bionic arm, upgrading it every time technology improves.

    Programmed to be a Soviet assassin under the code name the Winter Soldier, he is sent on covert wetworks missions, becoming increasingly ruthless and efficient as he kills in the name of the state.

    If this is to what you are refering, then John Kerry and the Winter Soldier/Vietnam Vet “hearings” were a Soviet operation.

    Most people would not recognize the parable/metaphor being used; others who might would shrug the reference off as a coincidence; the few outsiders who understand are too few and probably on the fringe-they don’t matter.

    This also is a giveaway as to the possible generation/age of the one who began/planned the operation.

  59. And it has come to this: America’s hope is that enough Democrats will act like craven, self-interested political weasels to dampen the effect of Democrats acting like good little communists determined to destroy democracy at all costs, including their own political suicides. We’re hoping, in effect, that Democrat politicians will act like utterly untrustworthy hacks rather than homicidal/suicidal lunatics. Irony doesn’t begin to define it.

  60. I’m intrigued by your comparison of Obama with Kerensky. The problem is, as I understand it (and I’m no expert on these matters), that Kerensky was a lot less of a true believer than Obama is.

    Betsy, I meant this in the sense that Kerensky was soft-left, in the sense that he had time for democratic principles, and acted as a transitional figure for hard-left takeover by Lenin & Co.

    Kerensky apparently did not grasp the depths of the perfidy to which the Bolsheviks could descend, but then he had no precedent to guide him. Obama is, frankly, too stupid to learn from Kerensky’s precedent.

  61. What is to be done?

    An unfortunate choice of title, given its previous usage by Chernyshevsky and Lenin.

    Yeah, I’m aware of the reference. I think it’s appropriate, considering I feel like I’m caught in a slow-motion Eradication of the Kulaks. Also, literally, what is to be done?

  62. Great post, neo, and great comment thread, too.

    I don’t mean to toot my own horn, but I caught on to Obama pretty early in the primaries, as soon as I became aware of the cult of personality surrounding his public appearances. The fawning sycophants; the swooning audience members. I don’t remember ever seeing anything like that in American politics in my lifetime. And I kept reading disturbing things about his background on the internet.

    I was not a McCain supporter during the primaries, and was not at all enthusiastic about having to vote for him in the general election. But when Sarah Palin burst upon the scene, that was a game-changer. She was the greatest breath of fresh air I’ve ever seen in American politics. I did something I’ve never done before: volunteered to work for a political campaign. I went to the local campaign headquarters every night after work, and assembled literature, stuffed envelopes, put together yard signs, and delivered stuff to other offices. I was too shy to go door-to-door, but at least I put together the materials the door-to-door canvassers needed. Towards the end I even worked the phone bank, which was a big deal for me, getting over my nervousness about making phone calls to strangers. I was equally motivated by my support of Palin and my fear of Obama.

    Despite the unfavorable look of the polls as Election Day neared, I was optimistic that the majority of the American people would vote for the pro-American rather than the anti-American candidate. Late on Election Night as the results became obvious, I turned off my TV and didn’t turn it on again for three full weeks. I knew then and there, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that we were now on a path to civil war. The next day I commented on another blog that I now knew how non-Nazi German citizens must have felt in 1932, and I meant it. I wanted to grab Obama voters and shake them, saying, “Do you have any idea what you just did?”

    I didn’t watch the inauguration. I had absolutely zero confidence that Obama would turn out to be anything other than a disaster for this country. I also thought that he would set race relations back decades.

    Pretty much nothing Obama has done has surprised or disappointed me. He is everything I expected…and feared.

  63. These times are a lot worse than WWII. The enemies were without, oceans’-breadth away. Thes enemies of our Constitutional Republic are within, they already hold the reins of power, and they mean us profound harm and eternal subjugation.

    It may be we are on our way to a 2nd civil war. Perhaps the (extended) South shall rise again, with States’ Rights no longer linked to a defense of slavery. In my minority view, that war was primarily over States’ Rights.

    If we are indeed on that way, 2010 is analogous to about 1850.

    One of my acquaintances left the UK for Canada after medical school, and ten years later was able to make it into the USA. In the twilight of his career, he is doubtless thinking that you can run, but you cannot hide.

  64. gs Says:

    “Yes, Obama is horrendous, but the problems with our political system go well beyond Obama. Arguably he is merely a (very serious) symptom.”

    Yeah, McCain was a bad candidate… but more people should have seen what Obama was. Most of what he said on the campaign trail was BS.

    It does scare me that someone like Obama can pull down (even now) a 40% approval rating. So much of the ‘moderate’ democrat.

  65. rickl — I now knew how non-Nazi German citizens must have felt in 1932, and I meant it. I wanted to grab Obama voters and shake them, saying, “Do you have any idea what you just did?”

    I didn’t watch the inauguration. I had absolutely zero confidence that Obama would turn out to be anything other than a disaster for this country. I also thought that he would set race relations back decades.

    I’m with you, Rickl. This bastard is every bit as ruthless and despotic as I thought he was. I saw through that veneer immediately: it would be hard not to, with your eyes open. All you had to do was look at his roster of rancid Communist associates and mentors, and watch him in public. So many times he contemptuously has let his mask slip, has let us see how much he despises us — how much he relishes the chance to grind his heel in our face.

    Sore-ass is certainly manipulating him, but this bastard is also entirely capable of destroying our Republic out of Leftist spite and hate. And is too much of a megalomaniac to admit, even to himself, that he’s being worked on. They’re all using each other, really: Sore-ass and all the other treasonous scum.

    I also had the same experience you did, Neo, of having friends, even the “open-minded” ones, who were impervious to even the most horrifying facts about this creature. All of the information just … bounced off. I knew we were done for when even the Jeremiah Wright racist and blasphemous jeremiads didn’t change people’s minds. THAT was the functional and moral equivalent of KKK membership, and it didn’t budge the Obamabots one particle. OR awaken any of the indies, apparently.

    We, as a nation, have been brainwashed, folks. By the enemy within. I can’t even believe this is happening.

  66. Thomass, I keep thinking of that 40+% approval rating for Obama, but if it is that high should not the democrats won in Massachusetts? Something is odd about that number. Maybe someone here can offer a suggestion.

  67. To quote Pogo, “We have met the enemy and they is us.” We Baby Boomers have no one to blame but ourselves. We raised our children to believe, or more accurately, we allowed our children to grow up believing that you don’t have to know anything, you don’t have to do anything, you just have to look cool.

  68. Neo and Jeannine –

    I feel the same sense of despair that you mention. Not enough people are paying attention.

    I feel like I have a ring side seat to this slow motion disaster but everyone else around me appears to think they are watching the best movie ever played . . .

    Steve Duchame –

    I have said the same thing for 18 months. Watching Obama during and after the election was IDENTICAL to watching American Idol. The same focus on appearance and the same group hysteria over nothing.

    Deana

  69. I don’t think the Captain America reference is meaningful. The dates don’t match.

    I always took the term “winter soldier” to be the opposite of the “summer soldier” or “sunshine patriot,” as mentioned by Thomas Paine. A “summer soldier” only supports the cause when it’s easy, whereas a “winter soldier” sticks it out when things get tough.

    Unfortunately, that term got hijacked by John Kerry et al — part of their 40-year insistence that dissent is the highest (and only) form of patriotism. That long-treasured liberal belief suddenly dropped down the memory hole last January.

  70. Deana, I have had similar thoughts about “American Idol.” I think the “voting” on that show has contributed to a popular-culture concept of voting in which the point of casting a vote is to choose the coolest and most popular contestant, rather than the candidate who is actually fit, in terms of competence and substance, to do the job.

  71. gs,

    None of the other people you mentioned are anti-American. Obama is. Gore has gone off since Bush beat him, but even he would have been somewhat disciplined by the seriousness of the office of the presidency. We may have a very messy system, but we do not deserve Obama. We primarily have the white-guilt-afflicted media to thank for him. Had they done one-tenth the work they should have done, the voters would have run from him.

  72. njartist49,
    VERY interesting and i am going to have to dig…

    however they picked winter soldier as opposite summer soldier… and give me liberty or give me death pain, talked about summer soldiers…

    THESE are the times that try men’s souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated. Britain, with an army to enforce her tyranny, has declared that she has a right (not only to TAX) but “to BIND us in ALL CASES WHATSOEVER” and if being bound in that manner, is not slavery, then is there not such a thing as slavery upon earth. Even the expression is impious; for so unlimited a power can belong only to God.

    Thomas Paine…
    http://www.ushistory.org/PAINE/crisis/c-01.htm

    Its the opening paragraph to THE CRISIS.

    almost all my references lead to very interesting things… but one has to taste the cake to know.

    thank you so much for tasting the cake..
    [and in that process i have something interesting myself to chase down for more info… 🙂 ]

  73. Artfldgr: I seemed to recall it was a play on Paine’s words, and I just looked it up. This is what Kerry said in a statement in 1971:

    We call this investigation the “Winter Soldier Investigation.” The term “Winter Soldier” is a play on words of Thomas Paine in 1776 when he spoke of the Sunshine Patriot and summertime soldiers who deserted at Valley Forge because the going was rough.

    We who have come here to Washington have come here because we f eel we have to be winter soldiers now. We could come back to this country; we could be quiet; we could hold our silence; we could not tell what went on in Vietnam, but we feel because of what threatens this country, the fact that the crimes threaten it, not reds, and not redcoats but the crimes which we are committing that threaten it, that we have to speak out.

    So it may be a coincidence. Or it’s possible it had a double meaning for the cognoscenti. I think, however, it really came from the Paine quote, as Kerry said.

    Of course, it that’s the truth, it may have been one of the few times he told the truth :-).

  74. Obama is, frankly, too stupid to learn from Kerensky’s precedent.

    agreed. so many of them, who think they studied history, tended to ignore what happened to those that played their roll. that the other side does NOT see them as heroes of their side, but traitors. that one would do so for them is nice and they are very happy to have it, but that does not mean they are greatful and that the person or persons have earned a plae to stand there, that never happens as such traitors are, what is the word… Suki

    ah well… history repeats and as aslan said, its different every time

  75. Trimegistus get the kewpie doll.
    sorry i had not read down to your post yet… 🙂

  76. neo, i am going to run out of kewpie dolls.. 🙂

    everyone who participated, has made me very happy today… because those that knew, reafirmed how many know… and those that didnt, now know.

    knowlege is the cure for the ignorance that creates the fertile feild for tyranny 🙂

  77. rats the post i put up with the winter solder stuff from thje VAW got erased… sigh

  78. @Artfldgr
    I am willing to bet that the double meaning holds:

    The Paine reference for glossy first layer few will penetrate and the reference to subverted and turned former U.S. soldiers for the real meaning hidden away for in inner cadre. This interpretation lines up with the occult/Freemason practices of true meaning hidden behind the public one.

  79. Sorry… I will disagree, but thats ok.

    the majority of politicos don’t get to any kind of sci fi of any kind…and cyborgs are sci fi… they dont even watch tv… they are very focused to one thing

  80. I too was struck by the similarity of the election with American Idol.
    This generation has earned the title the Worse Generation in terms of maturity, wisdom and character.
    Peoples deserve the governments they get.

  81. I are able to see a huge improvement 鄱nside your Posts, I’ll love to get in contact. Keep up the amazing work! Your Posts are really inspirational for someone whos going to be new to the sort of stuff.

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