June 27th, 2011

Separated at birth: Mandy Patinkin and Pinchas Zukerman?

They’re both musical; Patinkin is a singer and Broadway actor and Zukerman a famous classical violinist.

They’re both Jewish, although Patinkin was born in this country and Zukerman is the Israeli son of Holocaust survivors.

But their marital history diverges, with Patinkin having been wedded to the same woman since 1980 and Zukerman married to his third blond wife, a cellist named Amanda Forsyth who is nearly twenty years younger than he is.

So one could assume that Patinkin and Zukerman must be two different people. But have you ever seen them in the same room?

I thought not.

That’s Zukerman on the bottom, in case you were having trouble figuring out who’s who.

Two of the violinist’s three wives have been musicians. His first wife was stunning flutist and author Eugenia Zukerman, with whom he had two daughters, both successful singers (interesting in terms of the phenomenon of multiple talents about which I wrote here; the Zukerman parents and children are all exceedingly musical, but the parents play instruments and the children sing, one opera and one folk).

And who was Zukerman’s second wife, the non-musical one? Tuesday Weld.

Yes, that’s right: that Tuesday Weld. And lest you think this was a passing fling, let me just say that Pinchas and Tuesday (Pinchas and Tuesday????) were married for thirteen years, which in this day and age is practically in golden wedding anniversary league.

[NOTE: Patinkin is now 58 and Zukerman 62, but the photos above were taken some time ago.]

19 Responses to “Separated at birth: Mandy Patinkin and Pinchas Zukerman?”

  1. I R A Darth Aggie Says:

    And on that day, I will say to the six-fingered man “You killed my father, prepare to die.”

  2. neo-neocon Says:

    I R A Darth Aggie: yes, I forgot to mention that he’s a film actor, too. In that movie he is the best.

    Or maybe it’s Pinchas Zukerman who’s the best. I forget :-).

  3. Sergey Says:

    Such amazingly close resemblance in looks is not rare among Ashkenasi Jews and indicates relatively recent decsendance from a small group of founders. There are several types, not a bit resembling each other, but rather close within the same type.

  4. Promethea Says:

    Sergey, Yes, I’ve always noticed certain repeating facial types among Ashkenazi Jews. My husband, for example, looks like my cousin, but they’re not related at all. There are certain features that are repeated over and over.

    The odd thing is that in Israel, the Israelis do not look “Jewish.” Just for fun, the last time I was there, I made a specific search for “Jewish-looking” Israelis, and saw only a small few among the hundreds of people I looked at.

    Americans of German Jewish origin also tend not to have that “Jewish look.”

    I’ve often wondered about this phenomenon. Were there certain villages that had people who moved across Europe? Why does my husband, whose origins are Vilna/Odessa, look like someone I know who has parents from Hungary?

  5. Polliwog Says:

    My six foot tall, round faced husband was frequently asked if he was Jewish even before people found out he participated in a group that performed traditional Jewish dances. His answer was always “not as far as I know”. We assumed it was his dark wavy hair and glasses thatcaused people to think along those lines, but I guess it could be a “type” as well.

  6. ziontruth Says:

    Promethea,

    “The odd thing is that in Israel, the Israelis do not look ‘Jewish.’ ”

    Inevitably, with an already initially large gene pool by the end of the 1950s, and the level of outbreeding that has taken off since the 1980s (when the integration throes of the Jews from Arab countries died out).

    So that’s not the odd thing. The odd thing is that, despite the example of their Jewish neighbors, and despite education initiatives to teach them of the risks of marrying cousins all the time, the Arabs in Israel (and I’m talking about pre-1967 here as well, not just the post-1967 territories) are as inbred as ever. Their men keep marrying the father’s brother’s daughter. They just won’t budge.

    That’s one reason why I’ve never believed in the efficacy of Bush II’s “nation-building” efforts: Against an entrenched custom, no voluntary initiatives could have a chance.

  7. DNW Says:

    Reading this thread made me feel like I began it by unintentionally eavesdropping, only to find that I didn’t have the willpower to stop. LOL

    And feel free to delete my comment if it’s out of order.

    But anyway, the idea struck me that you could probably make a game or maybe an experiment of this in a way that would have some interest for perceptual psychologists or anthropologists; but that it also would probably soon be spoiled by crazies.

    For my part, I don’t know how anyone could tell if someone is Jewish by looks, or not; as some here have already pointed out.

    Place old images of two female singers’ pictures side by side. A young Barbara Streisand and a young Lesley Gore. Which is Jewish?

    And what about Spartacus and Captain Kirk?

  8. T Says:

    For those interested in the possible reason for any noted facial similarities, it appears that mitochondrial DNA can trace 40% of all Ashkenazy Jews back to only four matirarchs.

    http://www.cjnews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=11404&Itemid=86

  9. Promethea Says:

    DNW . . .

    The point isn’t that all Jews look “Jewish.” The point is that some people look “Jewish,” and there are several facial types that repeat themselves.

    Most people in my Jewish family don’t have any of these particular facial types, but my husband and my cousin both have one of them, even though they aren’t related.

    I suppose one can recognize certain facial types among various American Indians. That’s what I learned from reading Tony Hillerman novels. His Navajo policemen made comments about the various other Indians in the area, according to various facial features and also body types.

  10. Don Carlos Says:

    I wish I could care, but I don’t. Neo tries to inject some levity with stuff like this, hats, clothes, ballet from time to time. But some of us (guys) just don’t care. It’s kinda like digital over-the-backyard-fence chatter.

  11. Beverly Says:

    This is off-topic, but hilarious. If you need a giggle: a kitten and her pet pit-bull.

    http://preview.tinyurl.com/3k59e59

  12. DNW Says:

    Promethea Says:
    June 27th, 2011 at 3:58 pm

    DNW . . .

    The point isn’t that all Jews look “Jewish.” The point is that some people look “Jewish,” and there are several facial types that repeat themselves.

    Most people in my Jewish family don’t have any of these particular facial types, but my husband and my cousin both have one of them, even though they aren’t related.

    I suppose one can recognize certain facial types among various American Indians. That’s what I learned from reading Tony Hillerman novels. His Navajo policemen made comments about the various other Indians in the area, according to various facial features and also body types.”

    Hi Promethea,

    I guess my comments were probably liable to some amount of misunderstanding, in part because it’s difficult to convey an offhand tone properly.

    I take your remarks regarding American Indians at face value. In some of the images I have seen particularly of the Zuni by Curtis, there does seem to be a recognizable – and to my eye somewhat refined – pattern to their features. But that could be skewed by the particular images I have seen.

    For what it’s worth in general, I did in this instance appreciate Neo’s attempt here at what another commenter has dismissed as, levity.

    What the hell, it’s her blog and if she wants to post on the amusing implications of stereotyped phenotypes or cultural doppelgangers then why not?

    She even has my extremely valuable permission to put up stuff on ballet, as long as it’s not too frequent, and she e-mails me a warning first. It can’t all be about combustion turbines and rotating modularies.

    And, of course I don’t expect all Jews to look like “Jews”, nor that they should, nor even that the people who self-identify as Jews within a particular larger population, and who recognize of have what they themselves consider to be a typical look, should then find that look repeated in other Jewish populations located elsewhere.

    And, I don’t think that you or anyone else has made those assumptions either.

    I do think the idea of type recognition and “self/similar recognition” is however more than just amusing, but is also interesting on a couple of other levels both anthropological and psychological.

    And practically speaking while getting back to types in general, it would be pleasant to think that there is more than one “Dr Cuddy” in the world; especially since there is hardly enough of that particular actress to go around in all 50 states. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/5d/Lisacuddypromoseason6.jpg

    But, maybe I ought to leave this topic to those who are more vested in it, and who feel more strongly about it than I do.

    Regards …

  13. DNW Says:

    “who recognize of have”

    Or have …

  14. nolanimrod Says:

    Pinchas & Tuesday? That might have worked as a title for Annie Hall.

  15. Alex Bensky Says:

    Time now for a reprise of the Jewish businessman in Shanghai and it happens to be Yom Kippur. He wanders the streets unhappily until he finds himself going down a tiny street, little more than an alley, and from one of the doors hears what seems to be Hebrew being sung.

    He opens the door and is stunned to see a congregation, all Chinese, doing the Yom Kippur service. Happily he finds a seat and joins in.

    After the service he says to the rabbi how delighted and astonished he was to find a synagogue here in Shanghai. “You Jewish?” asks the rabbi and the guy nods.”

    “Funny,” says the rabbi, “no lookee Jewish.”

    Meanwhile I am impressed to learn that Patimkin was married to Thalia Meninger.

  16. LAG Says:

    I’d have to see Zukerman’s sword work, and hear him say, “Prepare to die!” to decide.

  17. Sergey Says:

    Genetics is not everything in determination of phenotype. Children of the same parents can be quite different and even can repeat different “types” known within family: and this is not only due randomness of genetic recombination. Some complexes of traits are inherited as single units from grandparents but absent in parents. This is a fascinating field of biology of development, which is now very poorly understood.

  18. Michael Says:

    Most Southerners can tell who “looks southern” and who does not. BTW, Eric Cantor looks very southern:)

  19. Gary Rosen Says:

    “Meanwhile I am impressed to learn that Patimkin was married to Thalia Meninger”

    … and Zelda Gilroy is an out lesbian as well as a CA state assemblyperson.

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