January 30th, 2012

Boy, I can’t wait…

…till tomorrow’s over and Florida is done. In fact, I can’t wait till the nominee is in the bag. And then the election can’t come soon enough.

Maybe I’ve just gotten wimpier as I’ve gotten older, but this really did seem like one of the more depressing campaigns right from the start, when the field was first set and the most promising candidates (IMHO) weren’t in it. Now it’s gone from merely depressing to viciously depressing. Even on this blog, the comments section has never seemed so full of anguish and rage, and a more-than-usual dose of misinformation and misunderstanding. I think it’s just a symptom of the difficult situation the nation is in.

And yet, compared to so many earlier troubled times, this is a piece of cake. The ones that come to mind right off the bat are—oh, little things like the Civil War, the Great Depression, and WWII—especially its early days. Even in my own lifetime the 60s were pretty bad: riots, assassinations, generational conflict of a fairly intense kind.

Come to think of it, maybe I really have turned into a wimp. Because we’ve weathered much worse storms, haven’t we?

38 Responses to “Boy, I can’t wait…”

  1. foxmarks Says:

    Just to keep up the negativity…this is a once-in-a-lifetime troubled time. I keep saying it is essentially at “Civil War” level.

    But for positive balance, the people always weather everything. If your time horizon is long enough, everything works out fine.

    I wonder if the perceived level of misunderstanding is a product of how handy information and facts have become? Now we can know just how wrong so many people are, whereas five years ago we had to take the speakers’ word for it. The interweb is another fruit of the Tree of Knowledge.

    Innocence was so much easier…

  2. M J R Says:

    Yes, neo, “from merely depressing to viciously depressing.”

    I claim we are already in a civil war, except for the violence and killing. That’s an awfully big “except”, except I wonder how long it will last.

    For World War II, our enemies were external, and most of the USA was united aganst the Axis powers. In this civil war, our adversaries — dare we call them enemies? — are internal. “We have met the enemy and it is us,” as Pogo declared?

    Yes, foxmarks, “innocence was so much easier”. I wish I could go back, and somehow some things would unfold differently. But they might unfold even worse! . . .

  3. T Says:

    Foxmarks,

    I think you’ve essentially nailed it, although I’d expand on the idea to say that it’s not just that facts are readily available, it’s the 24/7 electronic visual news cycle. Think about the Civil War, if one didn’t live near the battlefield, one relied on print reports of the events. The translation of a battle to print sanitizes it–no matter how hard the author tries to convey the brutality of war. Now, the electronic media puts that in our face to draw eyes and page clicks–and we become the equivalent of motorists slowing down to observe a tragic auto accident.

    Just how many auto accidents can one absorb without weariness or perhaps revulsion.

  4. Perfected democrat Says:

    Don’t cheer up, and please pardon my redundancy, but the problem with two mainstream Democrats running as the top candidates for President for the Republican Party against our Moslem-Communist posing as a Christian-Democrat for the now mainstream socialist party posing as Democrats is that it can only get worse. You can work your way out of a depression, and fight your way out of a war, if you haven’t ceded major authority to left-wing ideologists. But once you’re docile enough from eating the the rotten apple of socialist kindness, given up your bibles and guns, and personal ethics (to survive), the equation changes profoundly. Until this century, America was still the champion for fundamental freedom and moral, though perhaps imperfect, community as envisioned by the founding fathers; with all the implications for why and how those wars and depression(s) were ultimately overcome: by the diligent leadership of free Americans, not “international” socialists, certainly not communists – no one else – the one absolutely essential part of the recipe.

    A little government welfare to help the needy through hard times is one thing, and requiring efficiency from your military is another. But once you rationalize the shallow decimation of the military in times as dangerous as these, and cower the masses (ie. Cuba, North Korea, big etc.) to bureaucratic authority in every aspect of your personal lives; once you sacrifice the noble idea of “The Shining City Upon A Hill” to left-wing dogma, the game changes. When “other minority peoples’ freedom” is not valued, ie women in Saudi burkhas, “Christians and others in Egypt and all muslim/communist government systems, and again, big etc., it can only get worse.

    The one thing left with Mitt or Newt, obviously not Zero and the Democrats, is that Debate and the Truth about things like “climate change”, carbon credit trading gimmicks, fiat money, and what and who really creates “jobs” may not be completely cartoonized. 1984 is a partially done deal, but we haven’t entirely completed the transition to the Brave New World of soylent green…

  5. gcotharn Says:

    re Civil War: Gallup Poll shows nation hardening along strict partisan lines http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/obama-the-most-polarizing-president-ever/2012/01/29/gIQAmmkBbQ_blog.html

  6. gcotharn Says:

    re civil war inside the Republican Party: Florida Republican leaders are trying to redistrict Allen West out of political existence. Entertaining video of Congressman West: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/01/28/allen_west_tells_liberal_leaders_to_get_the_hell_out_of_the_usa.html

  7. kaba Says:

    I live in Florida. Political ads 24/7 in virtually all media. You think you’ll be glad when the vote here is over……

  8. Mike Mc. Says:

    I don’t think we have been through worse. Obama is the representative of an existential threat to America. He stands for one side in a simmering civil war between Americans and those who don’t want America any more. He also stands as the representative of the anusive elitist governemtn thaths lowt the consent of the governed. They govern like pre-1776 sovereigns. We are n trouble.

    People know this and so the anxiety is high.

    That is why I am sure Obama will be gone a year from now. America must survive. The alternative is unthinkable. All of our candidates are capable of winning and governing well. And everyone knows that too!!!

  9. neo-neocon Says:

    MikeMc.: was not the Civil War an “existential threat to America?” Half of it wanted to split off and form a new country! As Lincoln said, “Now we are engaged in a great civil war testing whether that nation or any nation so conceived and so dedicated can long endure.”

    I’d take his word for it.

  10. Parker Says:

    Politics is a nasty affair. Periods of commonality and civility are rare. The vile hissy fit the democrats threw when Gore lost FL still poisons the national discourse. Both Newt and Romney are setting the wrong tone with their mutual suicide pact which provides BHO’s campaign with plenty of ammo. I understand that they have to attack each other, but the tone of their attacks are unfortunate IMO. They need to focus on Obama’s record. They need to contrast how they will be a different president than the narcissus in chief.

  11. rickl Says:

    I don’t remember who it was, but someone coined the phrase “cold civil war” several years ago. I think it was shortly after the contentious 2000 election. The phrase combines “civil war” with “cold war” and I think it’s a very apt description of where we are now.

    Just as with the historical Cold War, it has the potential to turn hot at some point. The stress fractures are appearing everywhere: liberal vs. conservative, Ruling Class vs. Country Class, private sector vs. public sector, “99%” vs. “1%”, legal vs. illegal, between the races, and now within the Republican Party itself. And everyone’s positions are hardening.

    So far it’s not as bad as it was in the 60s (either the 1860s or the 1960s). We haven’t had much in the way of overt violence or political assassinations. But I’m increasingly getting the feeling of sitting on a powder keg. When it blows, look out.

  12. Randy Says:

    “I can’t wait till the nominee is in the bag”

    I can. I am fed up with these things being decided before Texas has a say in the matter.

    This SERIOUSLY has to change.

  13. rickl Says:

    Randy:
    Same here. I’m in Pennsylvania, and our primary isn’t until late April.

    In 2008, by the time I had a chance to vote, everyone had dropped out except McCain, Graham, and Paul, and McCain had the nomination all but locked up. Of course I voted for Paul. It was a no-brainer.

    The primary system is completely broken. There is no rational reason why the same few states get to first every time, and the early dates are front-loaded with open primaries, which means that Democrat voters get to have a disproportionate say in the Republican nominee.

    I think Pennsylvania has behaved responsibly in not trying to push its primary earlier. The national GOP should take steps to push the early primaries back closer to spring, and institute some kind of rotation system so the same few states aren’t among the first in every election.

  14. NeoConScum Says:

    Obama, His Infantile Majesty aka The Boy King, is the ‘Existential Threat’ from inside that wishes to shift America’s axis and make it, for all time, an officially sponsored nation of Takers dependent on Big Nanny State. Liberty/Freedom are to be diminished entirely and Officially replaced with Fairness and Equality aka “Teamwork”. I disliked him 3-years ago(and before), but I have come to loathe him. He wishes to deliberately turn our Liberty Loving and Entirely Unique Experiment into a Leftist Catastrophe.

    The November Election is the most important since Lincoln.

  15. rickl Says:

    The November Election is the most important since Lincoln.

    And we all know how that turned out.

  16. Parker Says:

    “But I’m increasingly getting the feeling of sitting on a powder keg. When it blows, look out.”

    It will be an implosion, not an explosion; if that is of any comfort to you.

    http://tinyurl.com/78emhrd

  17. ELC Says:

    There is no rational reason why the same few states get to first every time, and the early dates are front-loaded with open primaries, which means that Democrat voters get to have a disproportionate say in the Republican nominee. It makes perfect sense if one wants to undermine the Republican nomination process. And those who are Republican in name only might very well want to do so. No?

  18. rickl Says:

    ELC:
    Yep. That’s the only conclusion I can draw. These bugs (or “features” depending on your point of view) were readily apparent four years ago.

  19. davisbr Says:

    I kind of took a break from it all over the weekend …it was same ol’ same ol’, and my preferred candidate was annoying me as much as the non-preferred choice was: a pox on both their houses. So this morning, my first speed-dial was to Walter Russell Mead at the American Project.

    He’s been developing (through a series of articles) an intriguing concept called “the blue social model” for a little over a year now (as I recall).

    But today’s article was both a summary and the “bringing-it-all together” [latest] chapter in his history (for a history – and analysis – it indeed is). And as such, quite worthwhile as both introduction, and to bring you up to speed.

    Walter Russell Mead The Once and Future Liberalism

    …if you’d like something substantive to take your mind off what has become a rather tediously tendentious primary, the article is thought-provoking and a great diversion (Mead writes very well …and has been linked to a few times in the past by neo).

  20. Randy Says:

    ELC:

    My thoughts as well. That’s why, if Romney loses to Obama, I will have perverse feeling of satisfaction.

    But intellectually, I know this would be a disaster.

  21. Mike Mc. Says:

    Neo,

    No. The Civil War was not like this. Both places would have been based on the Declaration and Constitution had the split been permanent. The rationale of the South was that they had a right to self-government based on the same documents.

    Through the Depression, Americans were still American.

    This is different. This is an attempted change at the ideological core. This was a rebellion waged from the inside and it may succeed. It is a very close thing.

    Obama wins and America is over. It is not Obama, as I say every time I get the chance. He is the symptom. The disease is every single person who voted for him. There are 69 million of them. Some millions have no doubt repented of their sin. That still leaves a ton, and it could go either way.

    What I forever will not understand are people who will vilify this or that R candidate and not those 69 million. They are the exact problem and they get a complete pass.

    Anyone who voted for Obama one time has done grave and irresponsible harm to this nation. Anyone who votes for him a second time is not “American” at all.

    You play nice with them you will be their slave. You pretend they are not what you know they are you will be their slave. You really don’t have a right to do that. Not if you know what they are and what they will do to this country. Not for those who built this place, there is no right; and not for posterity, there is no right.

    I don’t like Democrats, as Democrats, and I take every opportunity I can to tell them how much harm they are doing to our country. That’s the very least any of us can do.

  22. rickl Says:

    Anyone who voted for Obama one time has done grave and irresponsible harm to this nation. Anyone who votes for him a second time is not “American” at all.

    Yes. When the SHTF, the two-time Obama voters will be fair game in a world of trouble.

    I don’t like Democrats

    I don’t like Republicans much either, at this point.

  23. T Says:

    “I don’t like Democrats

    I don’t like Republicans much either, at this point.”

    I couldn’t agree more!

  24. neo-neocon Says:

    Mike Mc.: my point is that the Civil War was “an existential threat to America,” not that it was the same threat as now, or “like this.” Of course they are quite different.

    I also happen to think that, although America was founded on a compromise that included slavery, if you read the Founding Fathers’ writings on the subject they knew it was very much a conundrum and a compromise with the ideals under which the country was being founded, and they knew that payment would come due some day. If the country had split during the Civil War into two parts, one part would have rejected that correction, and held onto slavery when its time had come to be ended. In addition, both parts would have been much weaker countries than the union that remained. America’s destiny would have changed profoundly as a result.

  25. Parker Says:

    Democrats, republicans, gays, straights, greens, blacks, browns, whites, yellers, reds, blues, 1%, 99%; yada, yada, yada. Its all a heap of distracting BS. We are dancing on very, very thin ice and the ice is about to crack. Below the ice is an abyss of debt and unfunded liabilities.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKv9p-lyKNA

  26. neo-neocon Says:

    randy, rickl, and others who are upset with the present primary system: take a look here at lots of suggestions on how to improve it.

  27. davisbr Says:

    …that Mead article I referenced above may help by putting things in an historical perspective too, neo.

  28. Curtis Says:

    The similarity between the South of the Civil War and Socialism is that both loved slavery.

    Socialism is, in effect, slavery: a slavery of the producer to the consumer/government and resulting in, quite quickly, a slavery to poverty and force.

    The main fact is that force and coercion are used to make someone else produce something with their labor and property for someone else. That’s why as America seeks to turn their producers into slaves, they will cease to produce and we will all become slaves to need, food, shelter, disease, war, famine, disaster, etc.

    But just as history, for Western Civilization, erased slavery so will it erase socialism, if it rediscovers the power of the ten commandments, the only set of laws which adequately reconciles the need of law for all man.

  29. Beverly Says:

    Will Atlas shrug?

  30. SteveH Says:

    What i see that makes this powder keg much more dangerous than during any other crisis in our history is the makeup of a significant portion of the people. Which is a markedly non resouceful bunch with an entitlement chip on their shoulders. Not to mention they’re nearly absent a work ethic or judeo/christian morals to constrain them.

    This level of dysfunctional citizen hasn’t been present in all the other crisis times.

  31. uncleFred Says:

    Those of you who bemoan your expected lack of impact in the later primaries need to think about why you have that expectation.

    Consider that no candidate can amass a winning delegate count before sometime in April at the earliest. Consider that the decision to award delegates proportionately this primary was made specifically to address the concerns of later primary states. Technically your vote are if anything more important than the early primaries because your primaries and caucuses are winner take all.

    So what happened? There are two factors at work. First the operatives from the Romney campaign convinced FL to move their primary earlier, which caused the other early states to move even earlier. This caused the compression that the rule changes were intended to prevent.

    But no big deal right? FL loses half its delegates and it should still take until April or May to get a nominee. Technically that is true. Have you heard that in the press? Have you heard it from the pundits? Have you heard it from the Romney campaign who are still trying to run as inevitable? No of course you haven’t. You’ve heard that it will all be over after SC. You’ve heard that it will all be over tomorrow.

    But you say “My chosen candidate has already dropped out”. True enough. Why? Pretty simple really money and the press narrative. It is very expensive to compete under any circumstances. With a press narrative that wants to get to a two man race asap, and an pac operated attack machine that nukes any candidate that gets traction against the establishment pick, it costs even more. Did you give your chosen candidate money? Did you volunteer time in your state to help his or her organization?

    Candidates dropped out because they did have the resources to stay, and because they didn’t get the coverage they needed to appear relevant.

    You can change the primary process all you like, until you find a way to address press bias on the process those changes will prove futile.

    Changing the process also needs to accept that each state makes up its own mind on how it will select a nominee. No process that does not honor that prerogative has any hope of being adopted.

  32. NeoConScum Says:

    neoneocon…Worth taking a look at John Podhoretz’s NY Post piece today.

    To see Newtie whining and objecting to his treatment by a fired-up Romney is truly comical… oh, and rather pathetic.

  33. rickl Says:

    This just in: A new candidate has entered the race.

    http://minx.cc/?post=326272

  34. T Says:

    rickl et. al.,

    As a counter-point and balance, see William Jacobson’s post “Romney has poisoned the well”

    http://legalinsurrection.com/

    1/31/2012 10:30 AM

  35. SteveH Says:

    And surely Thomas Sowell should give pause to the gung ho Romney frenzy.

    http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/289700/florida-smear-campaign-thomas-sowell

  36. Curtis Says:

    If Romney or Gingrich had any genuine humor, what a long way that would go.

    With voices from all parts declaring Romney and Gingrich unelectable, the stage has been set and will take a bit of work, tinged with hypocrisy, to clear it. And it may not get cleared enough!

    I’ve courted the rather extreme position that another Obama presidency has some advantages. For one, what do you expect Obama to do that he isn’t doing already? Next, the economy must pay the price for being propped up by debt and printing. Let Obama bear the blame as it becomes overwhelmingly clear that paying unions and expanding the federal government is not the answer but the problem. If Obamacare is not repealed, let him also bear the outrage as its costs and ineffectiveness become apparent. Consult the Walter Russell Mead article The Once and Future Liberalism linked by davisbr and particularly the idea of “blue government.” Blue government is dead and Obama’s attempt at revisiting it will be his Frankenstein monster come back to claim its due for a horrid existence.

  37. Parker Says:

    “Next, the economy must pay the price for being propped up by debt and printing.”

    Curtis,

    That is the understatement of the 21st century! The chickens will soon come home to roost, but will not be the fowl Reverend Wright prays for. Instead, with BHO reinstalled for another 4 years it will be a crisis that will not go to waste. We will not, as Franklin said, keep a republic because we will quickly experience a transmutation into full blown fascism. Once that happens the debate will be over whether curfew should begin at 6 or 7 PM and end are 5 or 6 AM. The MSM will be 24/7 debating the difference between 6 or 6:30 or 7 PM and 5 or 5:30 or 6 AM. I don’t want to go down that dark alley.

  38. foxmarks Says:

    “It is not Obama, as I say every time I get the chance. He is the symptom. The disease is every single person who voted for him the phony alternatives presented by the bi-factional ruling class. There are 69 over 150 million of them. Some few millions have no doubt repented of their sin. That still leaves a ton, and it could go either way will grind themselves away.

    What I forever will not understand are people who will vilify this or that R status quo candidate and not those 69 150 million. They are the exact problem and they get a complete pass.

    Anyone who voted for Obama one time submission has done grave and irresponsible harm to this nation. Anyone who votes for him that way a second time is not “American” at all.”

    Fixed it for you.

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Previously a lifelong Democrat, born in New York and living in New England, surrounded by liberals on all sides, I've found myself slowly but surely leaving the fold and becoming that dread thing: a neocon.
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