The Bill Cosby rape allegations
My thoughts on the subject of the multiple rape allegations against Bill Cosby:
(1) I have no idea whether Bill Cosby is guilty of rape. Neither do you, and neither does anybody except Cosby, and each woman who has accused him. And each woman only knows about her own case, not the others.
(2) Rape is one of the most difficult crimes to deal with in the evidentiary sense, unless the woman goes immediately to the authorities and semen is found. Even then, the question of consent arises, unless she’s been abducted and beaten or otherwise physically injured. Not all rapes match that set of circumstances, and without such things the case becomes a “he said, she said” nightmare.
(3) There are plenty of sociopaths willing to lie about a celebrity to make a buck and get their 15 minutes of fame.
(4) On the other hand, there are plenty of sociopaths who present a good facade and yet are capable of committing such a crime.
(5) One of the most important elements of these cases is when it was that each woman came forward. Their veracity is especially suspect if they came forward after it became public knowledge that the first woman had accused Cosby of rape and and the idea of a lawsuit and a settlement was in the air. If they came forward before those facts were known, the chances that they are telling the truth is improved, although it certainly is not proven. I haven’t read anything that answers my question of “when?,” but I’m guessing they all came forward after.
(6) Demeanor matters—although again, it proves nothing. I watched two of the accusers tell their tales on TV, and if I had to guess (and it would only be a guess), I’d say that they are lying. But, to repeat #1, I really do not know.
(7) Despite all of this, many people feel absolutely sure that Cosby is guilty.
Trust thy gut.
Remember Salem!
Guilty by virtue of a preponderance of allegations. That’s not to imply that he is not guilty, but the dearth of physical and corroborating evidence does not favor his accusers.
My gut tells me that there’s something at the bottom of this, though not all the allegations may be true.
On the other hand, I was amazed that one of the accusers said something like, “after a glass of wine and a pill, I lost consciousness.” A pill? Is there not some agency in taking a pill?
I was going to say these allegations have dogged him for decades. His settlement (sometime after 2000 IIRC) with some accusers also does not bode well for Cosby’s innocence.
As to evidence, evidence in current rap cases can be difficult to obtain. For rape cases going back over 30 years, unless a hospital used a rape kit and safely stored those reults, fahgeddaboudit.
I have no opinion on this other than I’d really rather not know if he is a rapist (nit the funny pudding guy!), but I am wondering why is this coming out now….
I remember how the PC class treated Roman Polanski’s victim, I remember how they treated Mackenzie Phillips when she told how her father seduced her and got her pregnant. And I just can’t believe it’s a coincidence that the number one representative of church-going law-abiding black people is being attacked in this manner on the eve of the campaign to gin up riots and burn down Ferguson. Read Leonard Pitt’s recent editorials, he does seem to be calling for Ferguson to be burned down.
Know? What I know is that he spent a fortune paying off a bunch of women who accused him of doing so. Included in the payment was an agreement not to discuss the matter. Innocent men don’t do that. Believe as you wish.
Now, why is this coming forward? It all started right about the time he began preaching that young black men act civilized and take personal responsibility. So, there is that. The left has no problems supporting the most despicable of monsters. But if they wander off the plantation, they will get the dogs sicked on them. They do it with queers, pedophiles, rapists, thieves, and the rest, in their ranks. Apostasy has a serious price in the ranks of hatemongers.
Doom:
He did not pay off a bunch of women; he made a monetary settlement with one woman.
And innocent men (and innocent women) settle out of court all the time. It is naive to think otherwise. Defending a lawsuit is so expensive, and the publicity so damaging to a public figure, that innocent people are often advised to settle and take that advice.
As to why this has reached a fever pitch right now,it’s because of a black comedian’s stand-up routine that went viral, and then was pushed by Howard Stern, and then the Daily Mail, and then just about everyone.
Here’s what the routine said about Cosby:
“It’s even worse because Bill Cosby has the fuckin’ smuggest old black man public persona that I hate. He gets on TV, ‘Pull your pants up black people, I was on TV in the ’80s! I can talk down to you because I had a successful sitcom!’ Yeah, but you rape women, Bill Cosby, so turn the crazy down a couple notches. ‘I don’t curse on stage!’ But yeah you’re a rapist, so… I’d take you saying lots of ‘motherfuckers’ on Bill Cosby himself if you weren’t a rapist.”
The time to examine Cosby’s guilt or innocence has long past. Statutes of limitation exist for good reasons.
I am bothered by two things in this story:
(1) the sudden witch hunt syndrome/Daily Two Minutes of Hate. These rumors have been around for years. Why the sudden witch hunt now? Why to people allow the media to suggest, and select, who they should hate today?
(2) the passive-aggressive ladyswarm of accusation … 20 years after the fact. I know several women who are all too eager to believe the accusers on the assumptions that (1) there are several of them and (2) they might have been “intimidated” at the time to bring an accusation of rape against the “powerful celebrity” Bill Cosby. Oh, please! Grow up and stop treating women like they’re children. Even if the DA doesn’t prosecute you can sue in civil court and we do NOT have a shortage of attorneys nor are celebrities in any way invulnerable. It could be argued that they are quite vulnerable to litigation.
We all KNOW that black men are rapists! Gangsters! Pimps! Misogynists! And likely wear shirts with women with ray guns on them!
Sure we do.
Do “we all” “know” that? Is that the presumption that’s operating here?
I suggest that it is not. I suggest that Mr. Cosby, guilty or not, has been saying things that are INCONVENIENT to establishment grievance-mongers, was in the process of developing a new TV show, and it was time to shut him down before he got a prime time forum for his inconvenient views. Just a suggestion, YMMV.
If he is guilty, he has been protected all these years even and despite YOUR presumption about what “we all” know.
Celebrity, power and deliberate, willful ignorance can stiff-arm the law and punishment for a long, long time indeed.
Case in point (which you probably have never heard of) the BBC’s late (d. 2011), well-known, very popular and well-connected DJ, presenter, and charity fund raiser Sir Jimmy Savile, who after his death and several official government investigations, was discovered to have had a 60 year career as a sexual predator, starting in 1955, whose estimated 500-1,000 plus male and female victims ranged in age from 2 to 75 years of age.
Saville’s particular favorites–male and female children around the ages of 12 or 13–were not only preyed on on BBC property, but more often preyed on and often raped when they were patients in hospitals that the celebrity was visiting to “cheer them up”–hospitals where, it is reported, he also apparently indulged in the odd bit of necrophilia (since that’s where the bodies were).
It turns out that there had been many rumors and accusations over the decades, but that they had all been squelched by the BBC, where his pedophilia was apparently an open secret (see the original TV report that broke the story http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvaawm_exposure-update-the-jimmy-savile-investigation-full-documentary-21-11-2012_news plus http://www.theguardian.com/media/2014/jan/18/jimmy-savile-abused-1000-victims-bbc and http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/06/27/how-bbc-star-jimmy-savile-got-away-with-allegedely-abusing-500-children-and-sex-with-dead-bodies/ and http://www.cnn.com/2014/06/26/world/europe/uk-jimmy-savile-abuse-report/ and here is a link https://www.gov.uk/government/collections/nhs-and-department-of-health-investigations-into-jimmy-savile to 28 official government reports about Saville’s activities, just at individual hospitals alone).
Well and clearly stated, Neo. Thank you.
________________________________
That said…Let’s see…45-years ago and 32-years ago…Uh-huh. Right. NBC known for it’s VTC* cancels consideration of Bill’s new series—With his presence, an almost guarantee of ratings success—and sides with charlatans & Lefty Race Hustlers and Cosby Haters. Breathtaking.
*VAST Testicular Concavity*
Myself, i do not know either. But I seem to remember that everyone “knew” that the Duke lacrosse players were guilty too. How did that case end up?
Let me see. Herman Cain is a black conservative who was forced out of the presidential race by accusations of being a sexual predator. Remember this:
“In late October 2011, Politico reported that Cain had been accused by two women of sexual harassment and misconduct during his time as CEO of the National Restaurant Association in the late 1990s. Harassment accusations have since been made by two additional women. Cain denies all allegations of sexual misconduct, while acknowledging that the restaurant organization made financial settlements to the complainants. Two of the four women have come forward publicly: Sharon Bialek and Karen Kraushaar.”
Now we have Bill Cosby, a man who has been a critic of the black culture for quite some time. He’s about to get a new show and will be back in the spotlight – back where he can criticize the black culture from a highly visible position. This, at a time when the race victim meme for blacks is starting to heat up. This, at a time when Ferguson, MO is about to explode and provide the race hustlers with new ways to spotlight all the racism in America. How do they shut him up? The same way they stopped Herman Cain. This is the politics of personal destruction.
Short of a signed confession from Cosby in the face of overwhelming evidence against him, I believe this is nothing more than business as usual for the progs.
JJ’s conclusions are shared by me as well. It’s pretty much their SOP, from an analytical point of view.
Wolla,
It’s not “celebrity” that protects a predator, it’s the power of the culture around it to obfuscate, deflect, ignore, deny and bury complaints. Savile operated because of the BBC culture protected him, much like the Penn State culture protected the football coach predator, the Church protected its in-house predators, and Hollywood’s culture protects the (I suspect) multitude of predators that operate there. The question remains: Why did the culture just now turn on Bill Cosby? I think the answer to that question is clear.
Also, I think the answer to that question further undermines the credibility of these old complaints against Bill Cosby.
If the mediaswarm which is going after Bill Cosby now is really that outraged by these complaints, why didn’t we hear much much more about them back when they were made originally? Where was the outrage then, when these ladies (assuming their claims are true) could have used it. Why do people allow themselves to be led about by the very people who have been, potentially, protecting this (alleged) predator, Bill Cosby, for all these many years? Online media social justice is rather selective, and lacks procedural due process.
By this logic, Tiger Woods is innocent too.
How so?
And who is arguing that Bill Cosby is innocent?
And didn’t Tiger admit to his indiscretions?
Details, details …
Usually the trials and tribulations of strangers, among whom are celebrities none of us know, are matters engaging the emotions far out of proportion to rationality.
Why, for instance, should I pray for the suffering experienced by a complete celebrity stranger, as I am so often asked to do online or in the media, or witness being done, as opposed to praying for the hitherto unknown child hit by a car a mile away from here?
I don’t know the answer, although the sentiment usually seems absurd.
Bill Cosby’s circumstances create a feeling a lot like the feeling when BO won the second time. Not nearly as intense, but a real, acute, disturbing sadness. So much for rationality.
The couple of accusers I saw also looked like liars to me, but who knows, I am biased and want Cosby not to be guilty.
Also, their accusations, even if true, strike me as the sort of victim preening which has degraded American society to an immense degree.
G Joubert Says:
November 19th, 2014 at 7:20 pm
By this logic, Tiger Woods is innocent too.
???????
He was ‘outed’ because he was arguing about — and admitting to — his lifestyle choice with his wife.
THEN Woods went public — and vented his sins to the world.
&&&&
As for Cosby, I could believe either possibility.
Regardless, he cannot be legally charged with a crime: no evidence.
$$$$
In my own life, I was accused of rape. The entire matter was a total fabrication. Quite the reverse was true: she was sexually ignored. Subsequently, she just recanted. I was informed that the accusation occurred because she was merely mad at me.
I was lucky. She never called the cops on me.
Still the universal presumption of women was that she simply HAD to be telling the truth — because the allegation was so serious. I can assure you that many, many, women will drop the “rape bomb” on a man with no compunction at all.
$$$
Herman Cain’s rape accusers were hauled into civil court. Every last one recanted. They all wanted their fifteen minutes of fame — and also figured that there was a real prospect of an out of court settlement from the front-running candidate.
The baseless allegations, of course, blew up his campaign… hurt his wife… and caused him to leave the race.
%%%
The Duke students were accused of rape by a known PROSTITUTE. The prosecutor ran with the case, anyway.
****
The ugly fact is that both rapes and false rape claims are shockingly common.
There was a case — that hit the news — where a gal falsely accused a boy of rape — so as to duck parental blame for coming home late!
His smart phone saved his reputation. SHE’D initiated the sex romp — scheduling it by cell phone!
Roll that around in your brains!
He was her lover one minute — and a scapegoat the next!
&&&
Colleges across the land have turned into kangaroo sex courts. Sobered up co-eds are hauling last night’s love interest in on rape charges — here, there, and everywhere.
A sobered up lass is in no possition to declare rape. Two drunks make the sex act an indulgence, not a crime. Without wine, there’d be a lot fewer people born.
Booze was out of the family budget during the Great Depression. The birth rate collapsed, of course.
When several women accused Blow Job Billy of rape, it was a ‘bimbo eruption’, and they circled the wagons to protect him. He really is a serial rapist at worst, serial sexual abuser at best. The fact that he is now revered disgusts me.
Now that you mention numbers, I’m more inclined to now believe that Bill is the object of the left’s two minutes of hate because of his going off the black Democrat planation. It seems to be the left is a lot like a pot crabs (the eating kind). When one crab gets too close to getting out, the others grab it and pull it back into the pot. I see the left doing the exact same thing to those who leave the black Democrat plantation. They have to pull him back onto the planation or they have to destroy him. Object lessons are really important to the left. It’s also important to realize the left feels totally empowered now, so that’s a good reason why these allegations are ‘the big story’ they are.
Oh, and related: TVLand has pulled The Cosby Show reruns.
——
Don’t forget how the black Clarence Thomas was savaged at his SCOTUS confirmation hearings with allegations of sexual misconduct. A black conservative Supreme Court Justice? He must be annihilated. The sad thing is, it wasn’t just blacks savaging Thomas (looking at you Zombie Ted the Swimmer), just as now it is not just blacks savaging Cosby.
OK, let’s say all the accusations are true. As long as he was a good black man, he was evidently protected. As soon as he started making ripples, then waves, about individual, personal responsibility, and showed signs of being conservative, he HAD to be destroyed. Look back at all the similar things that have happened, many of them discussed above. Don’t forget the Duck Dynasty scenario. Right out of the play book. Like the “Chicks on the Right” are fond of saying, I, too, am about ready to start passing out throat punches.
One? That you know about. If I remember, there were a bunch of hands out. They all went away. I doubt if only one was paid.
Nice comment. We don’t know the truth of the Cosby allegations other than that they are being made.
RickZ – Great compare and contrast! But also, in contrast to Cosby’s case, in Clinton’s cases there was actual evidence, third party witnesses, blue dresses, etc., aside from the womens’ accusations that Clinton sexually harassed and even raped women. There are plenty more predators being protected because they’re down with the cause. More reason to NOT trust the Palace Guard and NOT jump to their conclusions.
Doom:
Oh, so you’re assuming the others were paid? Unwarranted assumption, and certainly not a fact.
First of all, they didn’t all “go away.” Some of them are the same accusers accusing him now. Some have been silent lately, but perhaps it’s because their allegations are less believable than the others. Nor does it mean they’ve “gone away” for good.
We know of one that got a legal settlement, which is not an admission of guilt. Period.
AMartel,
Yep, there sure was evidence of Clinton’s forceful dallying, including testimony from Clinton’s state police protection detail.
AMartel,
One more thing. I now wonder if allegations of black sexual misconduct are a racial ‘Mandingo’ thing.
A white guy like Clinton got away with it because he was personable and likable. A white guy like Anthony Weiner did not because he was a loathsome creature.
But because blacks have this studly, many baby mamas image, the allegations against conservative blacks are easier to believe and so inflict more damage.
At least one, and perhaps several of his accusers has stated that, after the first “rape”, they continued to see him and put themselves in the same position to be “drugged” and “raped” again and again. Hmmmmmmmmm…….
RickZ – You may have a point there that I didn’t give much credence to in this case because this stereotyped image of black men as sexually promiscuous/dangerous/threatening has just never registered with me. I do know it has extensive historical precedent and still abides in pathetic minds of all races. With Justice Thomas and Herman Cain and now in this case, I just see the left utilizing whatever useful idiot is at hand to undermine these men. The fact that the useful idiots in question are female may or may not be coincidence. OTOH, Weiner was entirely disposable whereas Clinton will be a valuable asset to the Dems for a long time. The loss of Weiner was a temporary set back but, in the long run, the Dems lost an unstable and unreliable personality whose sexcesses were undeniable.
Your analysis speaks volumes about progressive projections, though.
I think a lot of what’s happening now — with the science guy in the shirt and with the resurfacing of the Cosby allegations — is the fruit of the “war on women” rhetoric the Dems have been tossing out there for years now. It’s given validity to some very loud women with a revolutionary bent. And with Cosby, those with a different view of black culture have jumped in as well, and see a great opportunity to invalidate all he’s been saying.
Here is a story that lays out a timetable of the various accusations and lists some of Cosby’s accusers going back to 2007 or earlier ( http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/11/20/i-warned-you-about-bill-cosby-in-2007.html).
Did he or didn’t he?
As they say, “sometimes quantity has a quality all its own.”
Thus, when I see more than a dozen accusers step forward–most of them now middle-aged and with much to lose in terms of reputation and the quiet enjoyment of their lives–moreover, with the statute of limitations long since run out and their accusations having no chance of getting Cosby prosecuted for his alleged crimes, and thus no need for or the likelihood of a big payout to silence them–I take their accusations seriously.
Lending additional weight to these accusations is the fact that the M.O. of the attacks is always the same; pills from the ever so helpful Mr. Cosby for an illness, or a drugged drink.
Some have, in essence, accused these women of having “asked for it,” by trying to use Cosby as a route to stardom, or sticking around after the first attack–although if these women were “rufied,” depending on the circumstances it might be pretty hard for them to remember or to realize that an attack had actually taken place, and in addition to believe such an iconic and apparently kindly figure as Cosby as being capable of such an attack.
Great mind Whoopi Goldberg not to the contrary, it seems to me that–minus a clear mind and informed consent–a rape is a rape, no matter what other circumstances there might be.
As for the theory that otherwise liberal Cosby’s criticism of “lower class blacks” and their lifestyle has angered fellow liberals sufficiently for them to suddenly attack him, or to cease to avert their eyes from what was plainly visible, I do not buy this.
I don’t think that racism directed at Cosby has anything to do with the fact that these accusations are being made, although, as some have pointed out, it seems as if all of the alleged victims were white.
However, if Cosby is guilty as charged, I do think it ironic that Cosby would have taken it upon himself to criticize the misdeeds of “low class” blacks.
You’ve made up your mind, Wolla, and no reason shall interfere! Lots of similar accusations=guilt, that’s the sum total of your logic. You don’t question whether this sudden random witch hunt is inspired by racist projection or lefty politics. Guilty, guilty, guilty! And guilty Cosby better stop criticizing those “low class” blacks.
I.C.U.
Wolla,
I agree, it’s the quantity of allegations, and the common theme of drugged drinks, that persuades me that more likely than not, there is a thread of truth to this.
I don’t want to believe this is true about Cosby. While i could take or leave his standup routines, I enjoyed the Cosby Show and wish there were more like it. I also saw Cosby as one of the few black personalities courageous enough to put a spotlight on the importance of the traditional family and the sad impact of its breakdown in the black community.
Of course that doesn’t mean that some of his accusers weren’t willing participants and/or out for personal gain. And it’s also more than possible that many on the left want to bring Cosby down. It’s not necessarily an either or situation.
As the saying goes, just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they aren’t out to get you.
even if the allegations are true, it wouldn’t be “rape rape”.
I see that in the couple of days since I wrote the comments above, two more women have come forward to accuse Cosby of attacking them.
Obviously the dam has broken, and it could be that a flood of even more accusations will follow.
As I wrote above, “quantity has a quality all its own.”
There are now 14-15 accusers. A couple accusers doing it to get their 15 minutes of fame, or because they have some reason to try to bring Cosby down–even an ideological one, or because they see such an accusation as a way to make money, maybe, but, 14 or 15 different women?
I don’t think so.
Especially since it was very foreseeable that if a woman came forward with her accusations against such an “iconic” and “beloved” public figure their life would be turned upside down as they were hounded by the press, they would lose their privacy and gain notoriety, would end up being shunned by certain people, and would be raked over the coals by Cosby supporters who would throw every accusation in the book at them.
Given the very predictable and likely very unpleasant, if not disastrous results of coming forward, Cosby’s accusers must have had very powerful reasons to “step out of the shadows.”
Wolla Dalbo,
I fully understand where you’re coming from.
But ponder this: The left lies. Period. Full stop. It’s what they do. They are sharks constantly circling, waiting for that scent of blood. Look at Michael Richards. Everybody and their dead grandmother loudly hopped onboard the ‘Richards is racist’ train. With Cosby, blood is in the water.
I’ll also say that because of modern so-called feminism (or Illinois Feminazis as like to cynically refer to them), I now tend to look more askance at rape allegations. When the left made destructive rape allegations political, my trust not only in the system falters, but my trust in the language, itself, falters as well.
When I was in high school, I read Cosby’s autobiography. He told about how, as a boy, he broke his arm playing, and hid it from his mother for several days until it was so bad it was discovered. He said he knew he would get in trouble, but also he didn’t want to burden her. As a young person then, and even now, I thought “Who could do that?” What kind of a home was that? So, a lifetime of deceiving.