January 7th, 2015

A conservative member of the House…

explains why he didn’t vote against Boehner yesterday.

It essentially boils down to “when you strike at a king you must kill him.”

Most of the responders to his argument aren’t buying it. It’s the old Don Quixote vs. Sancho Panza argument again. As usual, I’m with Sancho.

22 Responses to “A conservative member of the House…”

  1. parker Says:

    Those who wanted to dethrone Boehner should have first determined if they had the votes to force a second vote. And, they should have known “when you strike a king you must kill him” and if your ‘strike’ will not kill, don’t strike at all.

  2. Illuminati Says:

    “It essentially boils down to “when you strike at a king you must kill him”

    That sums up our problem doesn’t it? Boehner is not a king. He is supposed to be a constitutional conservative. Although I’m a Tea Party conservative I’ve been rather cool to the movement against the Republican party establishment since I’ve felt we need to work together. If Boehner really acts like a king and really does take revenge, I’ll have to reevaluate my attitude.

  3. AMartel Says:

    I don’t blame those who didn’t vote to dethrone but I also don’t blame those who did. The “strike” against the “king” was, in actuality, a vote of no confidence (entirely justified IMO) in the Speaker of the House. Not a “strike.” Not a “king” though he has proceeded to carry on like an offended monarch about this little dust-up. Yes, it’s just a saying but there must be some saying for what happens if you don’t succeed at first. Something about trying again.

  4. Oldflyer Says:

    Well, I hope that the dissenters had the good sense to count votes before they split the GOP. I trust they knew that the Dims would vote in a bloc.

    Two surprising aspects. First, that the Dims had no more self respect individually, and respect for their caucus, than to vote en masse for Pelosi. Really?

    Second, that there is no wise “Old Head” in the GOP caucus who could, or would, take Boehner aside and tell him to forget it. “Time to go John. Here, you can cry on my shoulder before the cameras arrive.”

    I guess the problem is that the none of the dissidents would carry weight with him; and the Old Heads, wise or not, are in the Boehner club.

    Opportunity missed.

  5. Oldflyer Says:

    Boehner’s relationship to Obama reminds me of a puppy which immediately rolls on its back in a gesture of submission when confronted by a human or a dog. (I am not categorizing Obama)

  6. Truth Unites... and Divides Says:

    Rep. Mulvaney: “Finally, the most troubling accusation I have heard regarding the Boehner vote is that I have “sold out” my conservative principles. All I can say is this: take a look at my voting record. It is one of the most conservative in Congress. And I was joined today by the likes of Jim Jordan, Raul Labrador, Trey Gowdy, Mark Sanford, Trent Franks, Tom McClintock, Matt Salmon, Tom Price, Sam Johnson, and Jeb Hensarling. If I “sold out” then I did so joined by some of the most tried and tested conservative voices in Washington.

    I can say with 100% confidence that I have done exactly what I said I would do when I came to Washington: fight to cut spending, stop bad legislation, work to repeal Obamacare, and hold the President accountable for his actions. That will never change, and neither will I.”

    #1. You and the rest of them sold out on this very important vote.

    #2. Refusing to impeach Obola when he has abundantly demonstrated repeated and blatant impeachable offenses is not holding him accountable.

    #3. With regards to this platitude: “It essentially boils down to “when you strike at a king you must kill him.””

    It is the mantra of cowardice masked by sophistry.

    I loudly applaud those who stand firm in faith who also stand firm on principle. Doesn’t matter one iota what the outcome is. If you only do things when you’re guaranteed and certain of the outcome, then there is no courage or moral virtue to salute or applaud.

    Eg. Dietrich Bonhoeffer participated in a coup to assassinate Hitler. He did not subscribe in the least to the coward’s platitude: “when you strike at a king you must kill him.”

    Courage. Courage. Courage.

    The RINO GOP of Boehner and his enablers of Mulvaney, et al flinched like cowards.

    Godless lib evil exists. 3 choices: The brave, the cowardly, the Vichy sell-outs.

    Brave: Ted Cruz. Or Rep. Louis G.

    Cowardly: Mulvaney

    Sellouts: Boehner and McConnell.

  7. Clarityseeker Says:

    Ha, once again the issue of “impeachment” is broached. Proving once again that emotion is more powerful than logic to some.
    Those harboring these notions are as tilted as the Titanic was, just before her final breath.
    1.) Impeachment is just what Obama would need to send his poll numbers back up to respectable numbers and beyond. Obama would like nothing more to have his opposition follow this tactic. The DP salivates at the idea.
    2.) The American people do not have the stomach for it. Anyone arguing to the contrary is delusional. FACT.
    3.) During and following impeachment proceedings, Bill Clinton enjoyed a resurgence of “job approval” ratings. Prior to this, his popularity and his poll numbers were in the toilet.
    Polls conducted during 1998 and early 1999 showed that only about one-third of Americans supported Clinton’s impeachment or conviction. However, one year later, when it was clear that House impeachment would not lead to the ousting of the President, half of Americans said in a CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll that they supported impeachment but 57% approved of the Senate’s decision to keep him in office and two thirds of those polled said the impeachment was harmful to the country.
    4.) The trial in the United States Senate began right after the seating of the 106th Congress, in which the Republicans began with 55 senators. A two-thirds vote (67 senators) was required to remove Clinton from office. Fifty senators voted to remove Clinton on the obstruction of justice charge and 45 voted to remove him on the perjury charge; NO Democrat voted guilty on either charge.
    Anyone who thinks that democrats would act any differently towards Obama, if impeachment were brought against him, is delusional.
    That’s the long and short of it.
    Logic…who needs it when emotion needs to be fed?

  8. Mike Says:

    Rep. Mulvaney:”…fight to cut spending, stop bad legislation, work to repeal Obamacare, and hold the President accountable for his actions. That will never change, and neither will I.”

    Of course while this RINO will bloviate about Obamacare and immigration, the simple fact is that he voted for the $1 Trillion budget which funds both programs. Talk is cheap, Taking action has consequences.

    In 2010 the people spoke and the Establishment GOP ignored us.
    In 2014 we spoke louder and again the Establishment GOP ignored us.
    You are right Neo, it was a Don Quixote mission but had 4 more “conservative in name only” representatives taken that mission, the “crybaby” would be out. So is the problem with the 25 that took their principles and conservatism seriously or with the rest that would rather go along and get along? Which group stands with the 60% of the people that thinks a change in GOP leadership is needed.

    Now a reasonable leader might question his motives if 60% thought he was doing a poor job. What does this leader do?
    The 25 are paying for their insolence by losing committees and positions.

    Perhaps in some small way, they agree with what now assassinated Charlie Hebdo said: “This may sound pompous, but I prefer to die standing up than live on my knees.”

  9. neo-neocon Says:

    Mike, et.al.:

    I’ve noticed that articles about the retribution enacted by Boehner mention rumors and things like “I was supposed to get the position but now I hear I won’t be getting it.” In other words, there’s no real evidence that the retribution is occurring.

    See this article for an example of the sort of thing I’m talking about.

    Now, I’m not saying it won’t happen. As I’ve written before, politics ain’t beanbag and people with power tend to reward those who support them and punish those who don’t. But it’s interesting that nothing much has really happened yet and yet we get all these reports that it’s happened or will happen. Who is making the reports? The MSM. Since their goal is to heighten the discord on the right, they have every motivation to spread rumors that will do just that.

    I’ll wait for something clearer before I will believe it’s happening. Again, I won’t be surprised if it happens. But it may not.

  10. Truth Unites... and Divides Says:

    “Of course while this RINO [Mulvaney] will bloviate about Obamacare and immigration, the simple fact is that he voted for the $1 Trillion budget which funds both programs. Talk is cheap, Taking action has consequences.

    Well said, Mike.

  11. Mike Says:

    I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one Neo 🙂

    When Boehner makes backroom deals with Obummer and has not shown any real principles that he stands for, I think there will be retributions. Apparently there were retributions in 2012.

    If nothing else it tells the rest of the Peons, there are consequences to one’s actions. Better stay in line and support the establishment.

    “Webster and Nugent, who served on the Rules Committee in the last Congress, were on the list to be reappointed until they voted for Webster for speaker, according to a House leadership aide who asked anonymity to provide details of private discussions.”

    “Taking Republicans off committees and denying them the spotlight of sponsoring bills are two of the few sticks Boehner, 65, of Ohio, has to keep his troops in line. He has used the committee maneuver before and may use it again when Republicans fill out the rest of the committee rosters in coming days.”

    “In 2012, Republican Representatives Justin Amash of Michigan, Tim Huelskamp of Kansas, David Schweikert of Arizona and Walter B. Jones of North Carolina were pulled off panels by the Boehner-led Republican Steering Committee in part because of their votes against the party and because they publicly criticized colleagues for their votes.”

    If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck ….

    http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2015-01-07/boehner-pays-back-republicans-for-voting-against-him-for-speaker

  12. boxty Says:

    I’m so glad our founding fathers didn’t trade their lives, fortunes, and sacred honor for a committee seat.

  13. Truth Unites... and Divides Says:

    “It essentially boils down to “when you strike at a king you must kill him.”

    Boxty: I’m so glad our founding fathers didn’t trade their lives, fortunes, and sacred honor for a committee seat.”

    Boxty, did the Founding Fathers have certainty that when they rebelled against the English monarchy that they were going to win?

    Or was it highly uncertain whether they would ultimately win, and yet nonetheless, they struck a blow against tyranny, a courageous blow borne out of uncertainty?

    I’ve read somewhere that only 3 percent of the colonists fought in the American Revolution. Thank God that that 3 percent did not listen to the coward’s platitude of “when you strike at a king you must kill him. The courageous quixotic 3 percent struck without knowing whether they would succeed.

  14. Charles Says:

    “Who is making the reports? The MSM. Since their goal is to heighten the discord on the right, they have every motivation to spread rumors that will do just that”

    Hey everyone, listen to Neo on this!

    So true, so true. The MSM will always try to find a negative spin about the right and a positive spin about the left.

    Reminds me of that old joke. The pope was visiting President Bush in Washington, D.C. They were on walking under the cherry blossoms by the Jefferson Memorial along the Potomac when a sudden gust of wind blew the Pope’s hat into the river. Bush casually walk out on top of the water to retrieve His Holiness’s hat.

    The Washington Post, the New York Times, and all other major newspapers carried a headline the next morning: President Bush cannot swim!”

    Funny, because it is somewhat true. They would print a headline like that.

  15. Geoffrey Britain Says:

    The issue of whether or not Boehner has or will retaliate is minor compared to the fact that a majority of the House GOP is evidently satisfied with Boehner’s ‘leadership’. They have emphatically declared themselves with their vote.

  16. Steve Says:

    If not voting for or with Boehner means retribution for Republicans then he should be very tough on the dems. But he isn’t.

  17. Mike Says:

    “So true, so true. The MSM will always try to find a negative spin about the right and a positive spin about the left.”

    I don’t look to the MSM for information or opinion. I don’t really care how they spin this. As someone on the radio pointed out a larger % of Dems voted against Pelosi last time than voted against The Crybaby this time. Never heard that fact shouted from the housetops.

    Show me one instance in Boehner’s Leadership where he has actually stood his ground on Principled points and pushed back on Statism?
    Show me one case where he didn’t show his “smallness” by not trying to “get even” with GOP dissenters?
    Sorry the GOP establishment leaders only care about Power and Control. They will lie, obscure, and do back room deals to get or keep their Power. We Peons are just suppose to fall in line and row the galley.

    Also in regards to the % of colonists that actually fought in the revolution I will accept your 3%. But generally what I have read is that 1/3 were Loyalists, 1/3 were for Independence and 1/3 didn’t care who won.

  18. Clarityseeker Says:

    Wow…
    Every time I hear someone (other than a Liberal/Progressive) on the machinations of politics——essentially “how the sausage is made”, it generally reveals their libertarianism.
    I simply understand that politics is a nasty game. Its inherently got many less-than-noble characteristics built into it. Se la vie.
    Libertarians tend not to understand the process of how politics get done (generally cannot see past their idealism).
    I do not like politics; necessary evil. I understand what goes on in compromising, and the give-and-take. I can only hope that the negotiators (deal makers) on the side I agree with are better at walking away from the table with a better deal.
    I laugh at those who ignore the environment republicans have been in since 2006. Having both houses of congress controlled by criminals for 4 years. And the white house since ’09.
    The Democrat Party=the criminal party
    The Republican Party=the stupid party
    Republicans have proved time and time again to be ill prepared in dealing with the criminal party {{{ head shaking }}}.
    Bottom line: I’ll take the stupid party over the criminal party 99% of the time.
    Libertarians? They generally do not understand the political process, time and time again proving delusional. If it was up to them and their negotiating “style”, the divisiveness in this country would be elevated.
    Ron Paul? He’s a pariah. An isolationist to the extreme. An affirmed bigot. And he is representative of the dangers of Libertarianism.
    Libertarians in my state assured the success of the legalization of recreational marijuana.
    Idiots. Short sighted idiots. FACT.

  19. Mike Says:

    “I can only hope that the negotiators (deal makers) on the side I agree with are better at walking away from the table with a better deal.”
    “Bottom line: I’ll take the stupid party over the criminal party 99% of the time.”

    And that is where the rub is.

    I agree with you there is an Evil and Stupid Party.
    The problem is that if the Stupid Party only has Amoral Leaders what is the end game? Is their foundation built on bedrock or sand? We know their tactical goals – get and keep Power. But what are their strategic goals?
    I agree with you the Libertarian wing are somewhat delusional and don’t understand “sausage making”, but they seem to stand by their Principles (a lot of which I disagree with).
    At least there is a chance to dialog with them and come to common ground.
    With the Evil Wing- At least you know you need to resist them as if they were the “Borg” 🙂
    With the Stupid Wing Leaders, are they all that Naive or have they sold their souls for their 30 pieces of Silver and the thought that they will win the battle on the next hill?
    I think The Evil Party and the leaders of the Stupid Party are both doing great harm to this country. The one by design, the other by the desire for acceptance and the trappings that go with Power.
    It may have been a lost cause for the 25 True Conservatives but like old King Theoden in Return of the King- Sometimes you march forward because it is the right thing to do in order to maintain your Principles.

    Gamling: He leaves because there is no hope.
    Theoden: He leaves because he must.
    Gamling: Too few have come. We cannot defeat the armies of Mordor.
    Theoden: No. We cannot. But we will meet them in battle nonetheless.

    Or like they said in Braveheart:

    “Ay, fight and you may die, run and you’ll live. At least a while. And dying in your beds many years from now, would you be willing to trade all the days from this day to that for one chance, just one chance to come back here and tell our enemies that they may take our lives…. but they’ll never take our FREEDOM!!” — Braveheart

  20. AMartel Says:

    Evil Party, Stupid Party … they’re both parties of big government albeit with slightly different priorities. You could make the case that the “Stupid Party” isn’t stupid at all but just drafting in behind the real “Stupid Party” (the Obamabots) so when the public finally wakes up from its Obamadream they will shoot to power as the “reasonable” alternative.

  21. nyght Says:

    Great rationale by Mulvaney. Problem is he never bothered to vote for Speaker 1 way or another in 2013.
    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2013/roll002.xml

    (Look for Mulvaney under “Not Voting”)

    I guess maybe he was abstaining or something? Or decided to not vote in protest? If so, he’s awfully quiet in the c-span vid…

    http://www.c-span.org/video/?c4520189/house-speaker-election-113th-congress

    (around 53:40 mark in the video, they call out to him a few times, and silence answers)

    Aside from the fact that I completely disagree with a lot of the rhetoric thrown around here… Boehner’s hardly a “King”. This wasn’t a “coup” or “mutiny” as Mulvaney flat out says in his “rationale” piece.

    If people truly believe that, then we’re lost. The aristocracy is here, will do what they want, and don’t dare be one of the plebes trying to question them, because they’ll put you in your place.

    Anyway, please forgive me if I don’t believe a man who characterizes any who oppose Boehner as mutinous or attempting to pull off a coup, and his rationale for this thought process is that he so bravely didn’t vote in Jan. 2013 for Speaker. I guess that’s his way of protesting. Doing nothing.

    Look, I would be far more on board with Boehner had he or McConnell or Scalise or any other party “leadership” have actually spelled out a plan to fight what’s going on, but so far, all I’ve heard from them is a variation of “this isn’t the hill to die on” or “we’ve got to show the people we can govern.” If there was an actual plan, I might be able to get on board with it, and concede that this infighting might be misguided. But I’ve seen little or no evidence of that.

    And the polls, if you care about that sort of thing show that a majority of the people who voted R in the last election want someone other than Boehner:
    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2015/01/02/poll-republican-voters-overwhelmingly-want-members-to-remove-boehner-as-speaker/

    I become more the cynic that anything meaningful will happen to change any of this with each passing day. Business as usual. Nothing to see here. Keep moving. Don’t forget to pay your taxes. Vote for the guy with the R. He’ll make sure we clean things up. We just need to wait until some undisclosed time in the future when we control Congress, the Presidency, the UN Security Council, the Supreme Court, and our border. Once those 5 simple things happen, we can actually get to work undoing some of this stuff!

  22. nyght Says:

    I also just wanted to note that part of the rationale, that this should have been done in Nov with the closed doors meeting… That was before all the bit about the CRominbus spending bill happened… Can’t imagine what would have happened in Dec. that might have upset conservatives with Boehner, but I’m sure it had nothing to do with closed door deals with Obama to fully fund everything for the next year…

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