Should we lie to kids about Santa?
Here’s someone who specializes in moral psychology, discussing the pros and cons of telling kids that Santa exists, knowing that some day they’ll find out he doesn’t and realize that you lied to them.
The conclusion? Hard to say what’s best:
…[T]here’s no evidence that children are harmed in either case. What’s clear, though, is that parents shouldn’t be overly worried about the repercussions of believing in Santa ”“ children are not completely credulous.
In fact, children continually take stock of what those around them believe ”“ and actively assess the uniformity of such beliefs to reach conclusions about the plausibility of various claims. As children’s causal reasoning develops (“Santa is too fat to fit down the chimney”), they eventually realise that he is not real, while understanding that other things they can’t actually see, for example germs, are. The key task for parents is managing the likely disappointment that comes when their children eventually grasp the truth.
My own answer is: know your child. Some kids are fine with it. Others of a different bent find it troublesome to learn they’ve been lied to. I was of the latter type, but some of my post-Santa angst had to do with the particular way in which I learned there was no Santa.
It was my older brother who told me, when I was about four and he seven—in fact, we may have even been as young as three and six. At any rate, I was very young, and I was a Santa-believer.
That Christmas eve, my brother went to his bedroom window and looked out, pointing excitedly. “I see it!” he shouted. “I see Santa’s sleigh, and the reindeer! There’s Rudolph!”
I was beside myself with joy. I went to the window and looked and looked and looked where he was pointing, and then at the rest of the sky. All I saw were the usual stars. “I can’t see it!” I whined, frantic. “Where is it?”
He kept pointing and saying “There. Can’t you see it? It’s right there!” I kept straining to see, to no avail.
Suddenly he stopped and became very serious. “The reason you can’t see it is because there is no Santa. He doesn’t exist. It’s just a story.”
This really made me wail. My brother was such a tease—and here he was, teasing me again. So mean! I wasn’t going to be taken in. “Yes, there is a Santa, there is!” I insisted. We went back and forth on that for some time, and finally I ran to my mother.
“He’s saying there’s no Santa,” I told her indignantly, assuming she would tell him to stop. But instead she told me (somewhat sadly) that he was right, there was no Santa.
Now, I’m not sure what my mother should have done. Should she have said my brother was lying, and that there really was a Santa? And then later on I’d find out that it was she who’d lied? I’m not sure what I would have done in her place, but I know that the entire episode was so searing and disillusioning that I decided never to tell my own child there was a Santa, and to avoid the entire deception problem entirely.
I believe he’s managed to forgive me.
“Others of a different bent find it troublesome to learn they’ve been lied to.
I was of the latter type…”
________________________________
I completely understand. You must have been crushed during the period where you learned that the Democrat party was lying to you your whole life.
Happy New Year
Yes, Neo, there is a Santa Claus.
And the message is just as important today as it was back in 1897.
http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/story/opinion/columnists/2015/12/23/yes-virginia-there-santa-claus/77790134/
You mean … there isn’t a Santa??
DNW:
Shhhh!
Just a story. As in: merely a story. Should we lie to kids about Odysseus too, or aver that he was a nothing and a nobody? (wink)
Hey, by the way, and speaking of Christmas movies which you weren’t, I’d like to interject here to give a 2 and a half star (out of 5 or 6) rating to a Christmas themed move which seems to have been almost universally execrated: Four Christmases.
No, it is not for kids. Yes, some of the gratuitous crudity makes you wince; and, the tone of Pentacostal Church scenes varies between seemingly brutal mockery and a detectable underlying human sympathy.
But the performances of DuVall and Vaughn were, I thought pretty entertaining. And any guy who’s sat in a car and faced the same thing Vaughn faces on the way to the gathering of his not-yet in-laws will no doubt find that elements of the scene personally resonate.
The implausible wrap-up, as it progresses, and especially the silly and superfluous last scene could have been done better or omitted entirely, and I agree with the more hostile critics on that. But it’s “comedy” and what is comedy without baby vomit …
I’d say about 40 percent of the film is entertaining and a small but significant portion is almost striking.
I think it was produced by the guy who was the child star of “A Christmas Story”
sdferr:
The problem with Santa, for me, is that it was not presented as a story. I received the impression it was absolutely real.
I faced this dilemma with my daughter, when she was about seven or eight. She came to me, very seriously, and asked if Santa was real or not. I could tell that she desperately wanted to be reassured that yes, Santa was real — but on the other hand, she was within a year or so of figuring out the truth, and would be disappointed at being lied to. So – very cleverly, I answered by saying, “If you believe in Santa, then that makes him real.”
(Nice lawyerly equivocation, no?)
A couple of days later, she asked me, with equal seriousness, that if she believed in Zeus and Apollo, would that make them real, too? (The kid was into Greek and Roman mythology … honestly, her religious beliefs at this time would have made an orthodox Christian run screaming)
Fast thinking from me, again. “No, sweetie — there just aren’t enough of a critical mass of believers in Zeus and Apollo any more, but there are millions who believe in Santa.”
(I believe to this day myself that one of the most useful attributes for a parent is the ability to think on your feet.)
Neo: Weird for a Jewish girl.
3 or 4 is far too young to be disabused of a child’s innocense. And Santa is entirely about children’s innocense. The world would be a far better place if there really were a Santa Claus and is far more brutal because there is not. Young children’s innocence, their sense of utter trust when loved is what heaven is made of…
“Suffer little children and forbid them not, to come to me: for of such is the Kingdom of Heaven” a Jewish carpenter residing far from the elite of his time – KJB
I think by the time kids are 5, they are discovering wrapped presents in closets, and pretty much on board with accepting equivocal answers that imply a “let’s pretend” reality.
Kind of rough on a three year old though. Poor kid. I’ll have a word with Santa about it. Maybe he can make it up to you.
Neo: What kind of tree did you put up?
Heck, I still labor under a belief that Odysseus was as genuine a material being as the whiskey-breathed guy who installed my truck’s last clutch, if perhaps a bit cleverer than my mechanic, all taken in all. Doesn’t keep him from being a “nobody” in a story though, since it’s the story Odysseus we can remember — which somehow gives him great advantages over the material fellow.
Or maybe Santa needs to be put back to work teaching something steada simply delivering stuff like a dumb stork?
Some very wise children continue with the charade so as not to disappoint their parents.
One of my favorite Christmas memories was when I was 4 or 5, judging by the home we were living in. I lived in Chicago and it was snowing outside, a family gathering was going on, the fire crackling and it was time for my Dad to tuck me and my sister in bed. I had no objections, as I knew Santa was on his way. I still have a vivid memory of what things looked like and how I felt. Joy, happiness, contentment, excitement. Childhood perfection!
Always had mixed feelings. How to explain when Santa doesn’t bring the much desired gift?
As a little guy, when things were tight, I wondered why my first electric train and first bicycle were “refurbished”. Santa’s workshop, I was told.
Later I felt that it would be fine for parents to be credited with what they could afford to give; while Santa was presented as the “spirit of giving”; or some such.
Of course I was out voted.
Had no problems finding out Santa wasn’t real. And, honestly, it wasn’t one particular moment in time that I remember. My mother never sat me down and told me the ‘truth.’ I just slowly figured it out for myself when I got old enough to think about the impossibility of it all.
After that, my mother continued to play Santa and pretend it was all real. She knew that we knew it wasn’t, but we weren’t sure how she managed to do it. (we opened presents on Christmas Eve…long story, but the timeline just made it seem crazy that she could’ve done this all on her own).
Never once resented her for it. She made Christmas magical and fun. I tried to do the same for my kids. Never got accused of “lying” to them. Both my kids still love Christmas.
Santa is harmless, as long as you don’t use Santa to purposefully tease your children, threaten them or make them feel dumb when they find out Santa’s not real. I have witnessed several mean-spirited parents who do this. Very sad.
London Trader:
My mother’s family had come from Germany in the 1840s, and they brought the German Christmas traditions with them. We even had the traditional food, like the lebkuchen.
Sgt. Mom:
Like The Velveteen Rabbit.
Exactly … most children figure it out on their own — my brothers and sister and I did. It’s one of those gentle and sweet family conspiracies, with the older children going along in in it for the benefit of the younger children. Usually. I went looking in my blog archives for a post about how my brother and I gently came to the knowledge of the Truth about Santa. Can’t find it – but we had basically figured it out from how my grandmother took us around to three or four department store Santas.
And my mother always signed our gifts as being from “Sandy Claws”. Dad was a research biologist, specializing in desert ecology.
I am not sure what age I was, but very young, when I figured out the entire Santa story was logistically flawed. I realized no one could live on the North Pole, no one could deliver presents to the entire world, reindeer can not fly, and the depiction of Santa as a rather rotund fellow made coming down our chimney impossible. My children were told straight up that Santa was a Christmas story, nothing more. We did the same with Easter bunny and the tooth fairy.
Nonetheless, we watched Miracle on 34th Street every Christmas Eve. We still do.
as a MOT I was never raised to believe in a Santa, but it has always bothered me that commercial interests exploit the belief in Santa to create unrealistic expectations in those children that induce further credit card spending by their parents.
We always told our girls that we “believed in the magic of Santa”…and that seemed to work. They still believe today.
When I was about four, I got a book about ships from Santa. I could read then, and I noticed the book had the local bookseller’s embossed seal on the first page. I figured Santa must have had an arrangement with local merchants so he didn’t have to drag all those presents down from the North Pole. Kids sort of figure things out.
My parents were atheists and socialists, so we were sure as hell certain that God didn’t exist. But Santa did. I remember my four-year old self explaining to my little brother that there was no God, but “Santa was magic” and would be delivering lots of goodies.
Santa lasted for a year or two after that. I think school did him in.
Speaking as a non-American I find the whole “Santa-Klaus” phenomenon very strange and frankly disconcerting;
– it is a bastardization of Saint Nicholas who was real and whose feast day is on 6 december, not Christmas.
– and all the silly extra’s around it (Kris Kringle, North-Pole, reindeer, etc). But this is but a minor point since Santa Klaus is totally fictional and anyway feasting Saint Nicholas has acquired its own pageantry
– but the really disconcerting part is that this fictional figure has taken over Christmas, substituting “Father Christmas” for Christ and making Christmas essentially meaningless.
Now the Santa Klaus figure isn’t recent. It started when the USA was still very Christian. I suppose it has to do with the fact that a virulent strain of Protestantism regarded Christmas as “unbiblical” but liked feasting like anyone else. So why not make up a fictional figure, stolen from “tradition”, to represent a “fictional” feast (tongue in cheek, but it is puzzling).
Well, if we can believe that the current president is protecting and upholidng the US Consitution, I’d say we can pretty much believe anything.
If people believe in superheroes, the state to protect them from terrorists, and national healthcare, some North European Germanic guy riding a magical deer, isn’t all that out of bounds.
People believe in whatever they want to believe in. They can even make their beliefs come true, with enough dedication and power.
So why not make up a fictional figure, stolen from “tradition”, to represent a “fictional” feast (tongue in cheek, but it is puzzling).
Half of Christianity’s rituals are adopted from the cultures they absorbed, since conversion was through agreement and society, not the sword the super majority of the time.
Christianity, the half that survived Islam, in the West obviously adopted Germanic customs because the people were Germanic tribes.
The Middle East Christians were enslaved and destroyed. Their customs, if any are left, can only be seen in the Jews. Just like Zoroastrianism isn’t with the Persians, it’s with the Kurds.
When our sone figured out about the Santa Claus thing, he accused me of lying to him. My response was to ask when i had ever even suggested that there was such a person. I had told him about St Nicholas, the real one, and those are ripping good stories, with our without gifts. It was the same with our daughter, and now with our grand kids.
Our entire family believes in Santa Claus because he is the embodiment of the spirit of selfless giving and bringing joy to others. When my son grew old enough to doubt that Santa was a real person, he and I discussed whether he believed in the spirit that Santa represents and the joy that he had experienced at Christmas time. What child could say no, or give up those warm feelings.
If parents surround children with love and let them experience the joy that the Christmas spirit brings, they will have a healthy belief in Santa throughout their lives.
Yes. The time will inevitably come when we reach adulthood and put childish things away, but it is unconscionable to deprive children of the lightness enjoyed in the innocence of youth.
Actually, there is a lesson to be learned by both children and adults. One issue is if children should be taught about the separation of logical domains: science, philosophy, faith, and fantasy. Another issue is if adults should be reminded of the intersection between logical domains. The question as posed assumes a fact not in scientific evidence.
For example, if a tree falls and no one observes the event, did it happen? If one person observes the event, but does not retain direct evidence, can they be believed?
While the verification of Santa poses a challenge in the scientific domain, it is really of juvenile importance. The critical questions are:
Should we lie to kids about the consequences of elective abortion and clinical cannibalism?
When should kids learn that spontaneous human conception is a fantasy told by immature adults?
How many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop?
Santa? Enjoy!
Another popular fairy tale making the rounds is: “Heather has two mommies.”
Really? What happened to daddy? He won’t be replaced in the foreseeable future. The matriarchy led by Mother Nature has made her choice.
Has he been reduced to a sperm deposit in order to increase good perceptions of transgender/homosexual females? Talk about objectification. Second only to the “choice” and a clump of cells.
And what of transgender/homosexual males and the missing womb bank? I mean, “mommie”.
Pulled out of the family home to become a taxable commodity, gender warrior, combat solider, and a womb bank for the good of career feminists and transgender/homosexual males. You’ve come along way, baby!
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