October 16th, 2017

Who knew that Courtney Love, of all people…

would turn out to have been one of the few heroes in the sordid Weinstein story (this clip is from 2005):

Note how she looks around furtively as she speaks, and almost swallows her own words as she says, “don’t go.” She knows she might get in trouble as a result, and apparently she did.

28 Responses to “Who knew that Courtney Love, of all people…”

  1. Dave Says:

    Jane Fonda had the courage to speak up against the government but no courage to speak up against Harvey Weinstein, isn’t that scary that these people are more powerful and have more means to destroy a person’s life than the president and the government. For those who still think Trump is the enemy, ask yourself the question why these powerful people are not afraid of Trump at all but are so afraid of people like Weinstein or Hillary or Obama then you would know who the true enemies of the people are.

  2. Artfldgr Says:

    A lot of assumptions. but we are at the point were anyone can make a claim… (and yes, i know Courtney… not well at all though). You can still take a tour and see where sid died.

    The big problem is the majority people have no idea about what they look at, is it the real person, is a persona, what are they like, what arent they like, what would they do, what can we fake they did…

    i knew one famous photographer in france who would use 1500mm lenses (over 200k each), and pay hookers to do sordid things to a target to create things.

    Harvey? have no idea
    but Harvey has everything we love to dislike
    overweight, unshaven, successful, pushy, etc

    heck, most people believe the fake trial by munzenberg was the real one, and that Sherlock Holmes is real, Churchill is not real, there was no first crusade, etc.

    and Dave, it may be Harvey didn’t do anything to speak up or when done, it wasn’t the way they describe it. you may be confusing a non event with fear of reporting an event (or visa versa)…

    and your also missing that behind the people you listed is something that can choose to create an example. ie. dem donors aren’t giving enough to win? show what can happen to their dirty arses if they don’t pony up – then select someone who seems unassailable that was helped by the same system.

    and how powerful are they?

    what do you think their power is?
    why doesn’t a lottery winner with more become powerful?
    is it their power, or do they get to use it?
    do you assume it?

    Harveys power is in direct relation to what people want from Harvey. You, don’t want anything from Harvey bad enough, so Harvey has no power over you.

    You would like to think the casting couch is innocent girls or evil men who focus on those innocent girls far away from home, and they are alone with wolves who do things to them.

    But to tell you the truth, it happens the other way around more than it happens the way you guys are fantasizing about it!!! you see, to think that and do something without knowing or anything else, is a one way fast ticket to someplace other than success… but, i don’t think you realize how desperate and ready to do anything a huge portion of the population is and how guilty they feel for doing that and want someone else to blame. It can turn many a decent person into a sleazeball.

    with that said. i can only say one thing
    we don’t know, cant know, and anything else, is all some assumption or some proxy that one things adds up to some form of knowing.
    which it doesn’t.

    what i do know is that the above is not going to be a standard
    its going to be only one story, and play out one way, and we alreay have lots of these little formal plays we know the answer to whether real or not… the butler did it is gone, the boyfriend or SO does it is a very common one (to the point of skewing investigations to try to find that which is easier than trying the exception).

    our bias, programmed or not, in this matter is HUGE
    Crystal magnum claimed what? and if that kid had not kept the ATM receipt, then what? how many at the rolling stone articles claimed gang bang of girls at the frat? and the list would be huge of this as well… (including one of the most recent being the discovery of who put the swastika up at a college, a African student. after all, if they didn’t catch him, no one would even be allowed to entertain someone like him would do it!!!

    and again, we find out that the only real way any one can be safe, and the outcome known would be to never be alone with a woman… end of story… if harvey was a perv, and he made sure to be with his complicit friends (of which there can be a huge number without any hastle), and always had a chapperone with other charges, nothing could ever happen the way its happening.

    the presence ends much doubt, the lack always creates it.
    which is why our ancestors prior to cameras, recording, sign in papers, and so on, found this and these habits essential to be prevented from being knocked off the chessboard of court.

    similar here.
    but we wont ever know.
    these are all old things and no physical evidence and lots of mixed feelings and such..
    nothing will ever be known for sure…
    (barring some very interesting things like tape, video, etc)

  3. Dave Says:

    It is fun to watch the democratic party went from “we are morally superior to the evil bigot party of war against women republicans” to “what we did were no worse than the republicans” in one day. Trump had said bad things about women but trump also did not run his campaign as the champion for women. When 99 percent of your votes come from people who deeply care about women’s issues, you better back it back with your actions, and the rebuttal that republicans are just as bad simply isn’t enough. Besides, why are liberals doubting the authenticity of the accusations against Harvey Weinstein? you are the ones who have set the standards that all rape accusations are true because you said women never lie about being rape.

  4. Dave Says:

    Hillary only gives a darn about due process when the accused was her husband, whose political reputation was crucial for her own political advancement. She told us that all women who have made accusations of rape must be believed as long as the accused was not her husband. She didn’t care about the due process of some other women’s sons who were being wrongly accused of rape as long as denying these people’s due process can earn her the reputation of being the champion for women and winning her votes from feminists.

  5. Dave Says:

    The statues of Robert lee had been standing up with no objections in the eight years of Obama being president, shouldn’t during the Obama presidency the best time to demand those statues to be removed? No, they only waited until we have a republican president to make those demands, why now? Because they never give a darn about what those statues represent, they only wanted to cause problems for trump. As long as the left can create chaos in society for their personal political gains, they don’t care who will get hurt.

  6. OldTexan Says:

    Interesting to see the ones who stood up to the creepy critter. My question is where are the lovely sweet ladies who sold their souls and everything else to get the great parts. We are hearing about the wounded doves, how about the beautiful birds who paid the price and soared on to fame and fortune?

  7. Ymar Sakar Says:

    I’ve been saying that Hollywood is a cess pit of evil, full of pedos and rapists that regenerate by recruiting those that come to the pit, ever since at least 2007.

    This isn’t anything new to me, although it sounds like it is new to other people.

  8. huxley Says:

    Victor Davis Hanson, among others, has made the point the most overwhelmingly progressive spheres — Hollywood and academia — are basically feudal employment structures.

    Once upon a time I was a bright young fella and all other things being equal my natural place in society was academia. But I could tell even then I would be eaten alive by all the go-along-to-get-along.

    I worked in Silicon Valley and a lot of it wasn’t fun. I did have to kiss up to my superiors to some extent — like any job. But I never felt, at least not in the 80s, 90s and 00s, that I had to slice off pieces of my soul to keep working.

  9. Ymar Sakar Says:

    Weed is also used by the Left in place of orgies, to break down people for induction into their cult.

    As a bonafide religion, they have “methods”.

  10. Ymar Sakar Says:

    with that said. i can only say one thing
    we don’t know, cant know, and anything else, is all some assumption or some proxy that one things adds up to some form of knowing.
    which it doesn’t.

    I know something you don’t, Art. The Leftist academics that terrorized you for so long, were directly funded by money laundered from those “casting couches” you seem to want to reorientate and rotate back on.

  11. n.n Says:

    Two problems.

    One, male chauvinists and the female chauvinists who love them.

    Two, women who were advised by female chauvinists to play the feminine card with men capable of self-moderation, and the not so few males who welcome the natural approach.

    Weinstein is likely a problem. Progressive social liberalism (i.e. monotonic divergence) and the female chauvinists who exploit men, women, and babies, are the greater problem.

  12. Matt_SE Says:

    Courtney Love had two things going for her: a counter-cultural disdain akin to the best of the British Punk rockers, and a buttload of money from her dead husband (and I guess, some from her own career).

    Not exactly Jane Everywoman. But then, that’s why we were paying attention to her in the first place.

  13. huxley Says:

    Also when I was young I fell in love with Tolstoy, or at least the Tolstoy who wrote the novels.

    Later I read about Tolstoy’s life and discovered he was a rich aristocrat with land and serfs. Like other aristocrats he thought nothing of pulling an attractive female serf off into a secluded spot and raping her.

    Tolstoy did feel bad about it later.

  14. neo-neocon Says:


    My natural place was in academia, too. But it never for a moment occurred to me to try to be there past graduation. I loved learning and hated school, including university. It was a bit of a puzzlement to me at the time. I had individual teachers and professors that I admired, but not that many, considering. And I went to “good” schools.

  15. parker Says:

    Well, CL has always struck me as a tough, take no shite broad. Good for her.

  16. AesopFan Says:

    Dave Says:
    October 16th, 2017 at 6:33 pm
    … For those who still think Trump is the enemy, ask yourself the question why these powerful people are not afraid of Trump at all but are so afraid of people like Weinstein or Hillary or Obama then you would know who the true enemies of the people are.
    * * *
    Many have made the observation this year, that, IF Trump really were the new Hitler, the people making that claim would be in jail or dead.
    They aren’t, and he isn’t.
    But electing Reagan as president obviously should not become a precedent for Hollywood candidates.

  17. miklos000rosza Says:

    We know a lot about Courtney Love here in Portland. She attached herself as a worshipful limpet to the leader of what was then the most popular band in town. Courtney was still darkhaired and fat. Then she moved on to the more psychologically-needy Kurt Cobain. (Nirvana played here at the Satyricon all the time.)

    I know someone who Courtney told she had no place to sleep, begged her to just let her spend the night on her couch. Begged and begged. Then Courtney never slept, and somehow ended up setting fire to the living room curtains in the small apartment, laughing her ass off about this.

    She was well-known in the local groupie scene for beating up girls she was jealous of, oh and just on and on full-out craziness.

    Courtney also could sometimes seem quite intelligent, and could talk all night… There was nothing she enjoyed more than “mean girl” spiteful gossip and shocking listeners (often with lies).

    She cited a good friend of mine’s novel as her all-time favorite and a big influence on her, but then when it was arranged that my friend would interview her (for Rolling Stone I think) Courtney kept standing her up or otherwise treating her discourteously that the interview was ultimately called off.

    I don’t accept that Courtney meant to be altruistic when she mentioned Harvey Weinstein. More likely this was the result of some private beef. If her acting career didn’t go all that far, well, she was very difficult to work with, and the acclaim she received for her first couple of roles reportedly went to her head. She also by that point was no longer that young.

  18. miklos000rosza Says:

    There was an earlier comment seeming to connect Courtney with Sid Vicious. Courtney had nothing to do with Sid. His girlfriend (who had some resemblance to Courtney before the cosmetic surgeries) was Nancy Spungen, who Sid most likely murdered in the Chelsea Hotel — in a room that was later walled-off.

    Courtney did however very much want to get the role of Nancy in the film SID & NANCY, but lost out.

  19. Dave Says:

    I have the feeling that perhaps the recording of Harvey Weinstein seducing that model was not the whole truth. Perhaps she was acting innocuous and defensive in the recording only because she knew the conversation was being recorded. In fact we don’t know her attitude toward Weinstein in their first encounter, what if she laid a trap for him by being willingly and accepting to his advances in the first encounter that lead to him acting so carelessly in the recording. Just my opinion that means nothing, I like playing what if game.

  20. FOAF Says:

    Great comments Dave, especially

    “Jane Fonda had the courage to speak up against the government but no courage to speak up against Harvey Weinstein”


    “they never give a darn about what those statues represent, they only wanted to cause problems for trump.”

    F the left, hard and often.

  21. Barry Meislin Says:

    Can’t say I know as much about Love as Miklos, in his most interesting post, but maybe—just maybe—she’s grown up a bit.

    (Maybe not.)

    Anyway, she made a name for herself several months back with this rather against-the-grain public attack against Linda Sarsour:

  22. Manju Says:

    Someday, you will ache like I ache.

  23. DNW Says:

    “Once upon a time I was a bright young fella and all other things being equal my natural place in society was academia. But I could tell even then I would be eaten alive by all the go-along-to-get-along.”

    LOL. You know there’s a structural problem in academia when you go or are summoned to the professor’s office, perhaps to submit a paper or review a classroom matter, and the same coterie of sycophantic flunkies is always there like a troupe of pet catamites; lounging, schmoozing, and gossiping with the master about the other students.

    There has to be, you conclude, a more noble and manly way of making your way in the world.

    And there is.

  24. DNW Says:

    ” Manju Says:
    October 17th, 2017 at 6:16 am

    Someday, you will ache like I ache.”

    How do you supposedly know?

  25. TommyJay Says:

    The interesting things about the Love clip are, it’s relatively old, it’s public, and she worries about the blowback.

    Kate Beckinsale offered a different take on Weinstein.

    I had a male friend who, based on my experience,warned a young actress who said she was going to dinner with Harvey to be careful. He received a phone call the next day saying he would never work in another Miramax film ;the girl was already sleeping with Harvey and had told him that my friend had warned her off.

    Does Weinstein really have a taste for destroying people? Did the girl laugh about the warning when she was with Weinstein?

    It must be true that the Casanova type enjoys, at some point, the submission and the destruction. Harvey’s own brother says he is a bully.

    Then there is the girl’s viewpoint. Candace Bushnell in the NYTimes tells of her girlfriend who was happy to sleep with Harvey. She was a pretty, young, ambitious and broke writer who viewed Weinstein as the ultimate critic and maker of careers.

    It reminds me of the groupie phenomenon. Groupies for rock stars, and stars of the screen and stage seems understandable or at least conventional. But writers as groupies of editors and producers?

    It made me re-watch one of my fave films “Almost Famous” which I hadn’t seen in at least a decade. I had remembered it as a partially autobiographical film about coming of age, and the pursuit of fame. Seeing it again, it struck me that the element about groupies was more central to the plot than I had remembered. For the first time I saw the last lines of the ending credits which stated that a lead character, Miss Penny Lane, a groupie, was based on a real person.

  26. AMartel Says:

    Pamela Des Barres was supposedly the inspiration for “Almost Famous”. She wrote about being a groupie back in the 1960s-early 1970s. Per her, they viewed themselves as equals to the rock stars and some of them really used the rock stars the way rock stars used them. Book is called “I’m With the Band.”

  27. Richard Saunders Says:

    Old Texan is absolutely right: now that the big shark’s blood is in the water, the little sharks are all taking bites, but had the story not broken, you never would have heard a word from any of the star “victims” who are now being so bold.

    n.n. — this is not a “progressive social liberalism” problem. Just as there have always been men who understood that “power is the greatest aphrodisiac,” there have always been women who have been willing to sleep their way to the top. When I say always, I mean always — Cleopatra is a fairly recent example.

    Harvey is probably one of the piggiest of the pigs, but I’m not sanguine about putting all the blame on him and all the innocence on the female starf***ers. If you want to build buildings in New York, you’re going to have to deal with the mob. You know that up front. If you aren’t willing to do that, you shouldn’t go into the building business in New York. If you want to join the Marines, you’re going to have some really nasty drill instructors who are going to humiliate you, scream at you morning till night, run you into exhaustion, and in general, do everything in their power to break you. You know that up front. If you aren’t willing to go through that, you shouldn’t go into the Marines. And if you are a young ingénue (male or female) and you want to break into the movies, you’re almost certainly going to have to sleep with powerful people (male or female) who can help your career. You know that up front. If you aren’t willing to do that, you shouldn’t try to make it in Hollywood.

    Please understand that I’m not saying this is a good thing; I’m just saying that’s the reality.

  28. junior Says:

    “but had the story not broken, you never would have heard a word from any of the star “victims” who are now being so bold.”

    Not entirely true. Rose McGowan has been pretty open about the fact that she was raped by someone important in Hollywood, and that someone turned out to be Weinstein.

    But she’s the only person I’m aware of who had been publicly complaining about his actions (albeit not explicitly naming him prior to the recent revelations).

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