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On building walls — 17 Comments

  1. Gary D. G.:

    In Frostian (New England rural) terms, a wall is made of stone and it doesn’t rot, although the stones can fall (as in the poem). A fence is wood and can rot. But he uses the words interchangeably.

    As a metaphor, a wall sounds sturdier.

    By the way, Frost had something to say about fences, too, in another poem with a very different theme:

    ‘I can repeat the very words you were saying:
    “Three foggy mornings and one rainy day
    Will rot the best birch fence a man can build.”

  2. How do you keep a repeating criminal who has been deported multiple times from keep coming back to harm law abiding Americans other than building a wall? a Wall obviously won’t be very effective in keeping him out, obviously not as effective as down right executing him, but it is the most effective among all the legal solutions.

  3. We don’t have to build a wall, I have a pretty good solution, every illegal immigrant criminal caught and convicted will have his feet broken James Caan in Misery style before being deported, that way he will never be able to border jumping back again.

  4. There is actually a lot for me not to like in the Frost poem: the implicit superiority of the voice, the disdain for hunters unseen, tearing stone from stone to please their yelping dogs and get the poor poor bunny.
    “The gaps I mean,
    No one has seen them made or heard them made,
    But at spring mending-time we find them there.”

    No one has seen them or heard them made, huh?

    Not a word about frost heaves, which in bitter cold New England winter can displace a stone or two, physically actually move them, and make an entire unmortared wall section unstable and so fall apart.

    PS: Birch is a very soft wood, rots very easily, and no Yankee farmer worth his salt would build a fence of birch. Frost has that right.

  5. Frog:

    I believe you may be confusing the narrator of the poem with Frost himself? I could be misinterpreting what you wrote, but that’s what I thought you were saying.

    The “I” voice in poetry is sometimes real, but often a poetic device. Frost is NOT a confessional poet. He’s a poet who often explores different point of view with different characters and voices.

    Here, Frost is contrasting two points of view, between a narrator and the narrator’s neighbor, and usually his poems are very complex and his own point of view is both complex and hidden in riddles and contradictions within the poem, if it’s revealed at all.

    Here’s some interesting commentary:

    Ironically, while the narrator seems to begrudge the annual repairing of the wall, Frost subtley points out that the narrator is actually more active than the neighbor. It is the narrator who selects the day for mending and informs his neighbor across the property. Moreover, the narrator himself walks along the wall at other points during the year in order to repair the damage that has been done by local hunters. Despite his skeptical attitude, it seems that the narrator is even more tied to the tradition of wall-mending than his neighbor. Perhaps his skeptical questions and quips can then be read as an attempt to justify his own behavior to himself. While he chooses to present himself as a modern man, far beyond old-fashioned traditions, the narrator is really no different from his neighbor: he too clings to the concept of property and division, of ownership and individuality.

    Another poem in which people often confuse the narrator “I’s” voice with Frost’s own voice is “The Road Not Taken.” The poem is widely misunderstood; I wrote about it here.

  6. “Such boundary walls are actually quite common around the world, as you can see, and there are myriad reasons for having them (scroll down at the link for the very long list). Is it only the US that’s not allowed to have a wall?”
    * * *
    It’s only the US that’s not allowed to do a lot of things, or is required to do other things (fund the UN at an outrageously high level, for instance, and send aid to people who want to kill us (although that last is shared with Israel)).

  7. That was indeed a very long list, and some of the barriers are up to 20 years old and older.
    I notice that one particular reason is cited for the huge majority of the walls as justification.
    Three guesses, if you haven’t looked yet, and the first two don’t count.

  8. Frog:

    By the way, one doesn’t hear frost heaves or even see them happen. One sees the result, whether it be the upward displacement of the road, or the movement of rocks. The freezing happens underground and causes the lift, and then in the spring when there’s a thaw there’s often more movement (generally, downward).

    Lots of information about it here, as well as at many other sites.

  9. OK, Neo. There is a lot for me not to like about the narrator of this poem.

    My point about the frost heaves, which you repeat, is taken from the poem. They occur unwitnessed, my point exactly, and Frost’s too. Despite that, he invokes hunters (and perhaps trespassers by implication).

  10. om:
    I have built several hundred feet of stone walls aka fences. They still stand, unchanged. They were not built in frost-heave country though.

  11. I grew up on a farm in NH in the late 40s and 50s and even as I sweat in the heat of the Western Australian summer the understatement, the sly implications, the irony, even the body language come across time and space with palpable clarity. Of course in that time and place we would never us a term like body language or fret over bunnies. Anyone who did would earn a well concealed look of contempt.

  12. I spent the last half hour composing a reasoned, dispassionate response, arguing that a wall by any other name would accomplish the desired result and how symbolism gets in the way. After looking it over I decided it would be wasted here.

    The first stanza of Belloc’s The Rebel, and only the first stanza says it better:

    There is a wall of which the stones
    Are lies and bribes and dead men’s bones.
    And wrongfully this evil wall
    Denies what all men made for all,
    And shamelessly this wall surrounds
    Our homesteads and our native grounds.

  13. Thanks for sharing the poem, neo. It’s probably my favorite of Frost’s, but I hadn’t taken the time to read it in years.

    I recall attempting to recite it for a classroom exercise in the 1970’s, my anxiety leaving me with a voice that was high-pitched and unnatural. (I did a far better job of it just now.)

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