The Emperor’s New Clothes: Trump at Davos
No, Trump’s not the emperor without clothes. He’s the kid who points and says the obvious about the naked emperor, “But he hasn’t got anything on!”
That was my reaction yesterday when I read what Trump had said about Palestine and Israel at Davos. Trump was not reading from a speech or prepared notes:
That money [from the US] is not going to [the Palestinians] unless they sit down and negotiate peace, because I can tell you that Israel does want to make peace, and they’re going to have to want to make peace, too, or we’re going to have nothing to do with it any longer.
It may not be very elegantly said—it wasn’t very elegantly said—but boy, did it get my attention, and I bet it got the Palestinians’ attention too. Had no one in US government ever said this sort of thing before? If so, I couldn’t recall it. Trump said he’d wondered, too, and asked the question [emphasis mine]:
If you look back at the various peace proposals, and they are endless, and I spoke to some of the people involved. And I said, ”˜Did you ever talk about the vast amount of funds, money that we give to the Palestinians? You know, we give hundreds of millions of dollars.’ And they said, ”˜We never talk about it,‘” Trump said. “Well, we do talk about it. When they disrespected us a week ago by not allowing our great vice president to see them, and we give them hundreds of millions of dollars in aid and support, tremendous numbers, numbers that nobody understands, that money is on the table.”
So previous negotiators had never talked about it. Why? Probably a lot of reasons, but chief among my guesses would be these:
(1) Threatening to withdraw financial aid is not what diplomats do.
(2) Europe certainly wouldn’t like it, nor would the vast majority of the pro-Palestinian world (which is the vast majority of the world, if the UN General Assembly is any indication).
(3) Previous administrations cared very much about #2.
Trump is not a diplomat. He’s a businessman. He promised that he knew how to make deals, and he deals like a businessman and not like a diplomat. Businessmen are very money-conscious, and they know that money is leverage they can use. If you’re negotiating with someone who is financially dependent on you—duh!—you can use that money for leverage.
This tough-love technique may not work, of course. But nothing else has so far—nothing, not all the diplomats in the world have been able to make the situation better in that neck of the woods. If Trump could, it would be astounding as well as a consummation devoutly to be wished.
Trump had more to say:
“The hardest subject they had to talk about was Jerusalem,” he said. “We took Jerusalem off the table, so we don’t have to talk about it anymore. They never got past Jerusalem. We took it off the table. We don’t have to talk about it anymore.” He then turned to Netanyahu and said: You won one point, and you’ll give up some other points later on in the negotiation ”” if it ever takes place. I don’t know that it ever will take place.”
Asked by The Times of Israel whether Jerusalem being “off the table” meant no part of the city would be part of a future Palestinian state, Trump responded, “Next question.”
Interesting.
Netanyahu had something to say, too. And it seems he agrees with me about the “emperor’s new clothes” aspect of what Trump had said:
People say that this pushes peace backward,” Netanyahu said. “I say it pushes peace forward, because it recognizes history, it recognizes the present reality. And peace can only be built on the basis of truth.”
The “peace process” was an oxymoron, because more Palis desire the “disappearance” of Israel than desire peaceful coexistence with Israel.
Do Palestinians Want Peace? Here Are 5 Facts That Say No.Here is just one: Palestinian opinion.
It appears that Trump may be more optimistic than I am.
It is true that peace can only be built on the basis of truth.
As well as a marriage.
Or a business partnership.
A recognition of truth is essential to any negotiation. Think back on the negotiation for our downed U2 pilot with East Germany after WW2. Donovan (the US attorney) really had to identify who was the person who could bring a change to the discussion in short order.
In this case, the world, the UN, everyone involved has not made ANY progress and the discussion hasn’t changed.
There will be movement ONLY because the conversation has changed. I don’t think the discussion will be positive in the short run as it is like a child with a temper tantrum. Those situations can be bad for an extended or short period of time.
Yes, at best the Palestinians will agree to a temporary peace that they pretend to be permanent. This is because first, last and always, the great majority of Palestinian arabs are Muslim and, Allah in the Qur’an has unequivocally declared that once land is Muslim it is eternally part of the Ummah.
It is a theological imperative that every Muslim work to return the land that the Jews have stolen to the Ummah.
Islam presumes that only Muslims have a legitimate claim to the “right of conquest”.
When the movie Exodus came out someone joked that the Palestinians loved the movie but they ran it backwards. The Jews all left Palestine and ended up in the concentration camps in Germany.
Had no one in US government ever said this sort of thing before?
Daniel Patrick Moynihan and Jeane Kirkpatrick
Just read a report at World Israel News (linked from Maggie’s Farm) that the Palestinians just bough a $50M private jet for Abbas’s personal use. A quote from the PA did not dispute this.
Ann,
Is there not a fundamental difference between the verbal criticisms of Moynihan and Kirkpatrick and Trump’s explicit threat to cut off the Palestinian’s gravy train?
Moynihan and Kirkpatrick rightly condemned the unjust attacks upon Israel. However they did not specify resultant consequences for continued attacks.
Whereas, Trump has connected the Palestinians demonstrating a sincere desire for peace by them taking specific actions, such as ending the payments to suicide bomber’s families. Specific consequences with no ambiguity is the difference
I read an interesting article lately (which of course I cannot find again) explaining what may be causing the Palestinians to be so recalcitrant about making peace: Israel is giving conflicting signals, and they can’t figure out who is actually winning the fight.
That is, when the Palis do something violent, Israel reacts to stop them, but then backs off instead of shutting them down. The Israelis act like losers instead of winners, so the Palis conclude that they must have won!
So, they go back for more.
Maybe, maybe not, but there is no denying that Israel (for whatever reason) has not “acted like” any other war-winning country in recorded history.
Here are three other interesting articles.
https://www.cfr.org/blog/trump-gets-unrwa-right
https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20171123-the-uns-peace-process-coordinator-is-misleading-us-on-palestine/
http://www.middleeasteye.net/columns/why-cutting-us-aid-palestinian-authority-not-bad-idea-2079978880
Sorry off topic:
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/25/opinion/jordan-peterson-moment.html?mtrref=www.google.com&assetType=opinion
The writer has a line in there that is a tell.
Trump really wants to fix problems, which is a big no no in politics and makes him the enemy of professional politicians as their livelihoods depend on prolonging any existing problems to milk them for as long as possible to maintain the status quo or protecting their donors whose make their money from these problems continue to exist while putting on a show trying to have these problems fixed as a posturing method to win votes from naive low information voters like the adults in the story emperor’s new clothes who still believe voting for certain parties or certain politicians make them smarter or more compassionate like teenagers forcing themselves to watch hard to understand pretentious European art films that they don’t like or can’t understand make them smarter and more special. Obama is the master of it, talked like a savior, solved no problem, helped no one, but people still say they like him and vote for him, because their are people out there still vote for someone like Obama just to makes themselves feel good about themselves even though he did the best he could to hurt the same people who voted for him, truly an evil person with zero redeemable quality. lying about being born in Kenya just to get accepted to Harvard and scholarship with the racial quota, tell you all you need to know about his character.
As long as Israel exists there will be no peace. As long as islam exists there will be no peace, but perhaps periods where the violence subsides. I strongly support cutting off all funds to the PA, but others will pick up the slack.
This tough-love technique [using money as leverage] may not work, of course. But nothing else has so far…
Might as well give it a try. I doubt it’ll have much effect, but who gives a flying-f*ck? If granting the Palestinian Authority hundreds of $millions annually is not helping the situation, just return it to the Forgotten Man, the abused US taxpayer who’s forced to pay for this kind of useless diplomatic bullshit.
One more thing about the hundred of $millions given annually to the PA:
That money represents the sweat and toil of hardworking Americans. And the fine, concerned folks involved in “peace proposals” can’t even bring themselves to mention it in negotiations: “We never talk about it”. Screw that.
Every dollar to Palestinians is one less food stamp for black babies in the inner cities, beg you liberals have never thought of that, they still think all the problems in the world can be solved by taking money from the rich. You think the rich will let you take it from them? they just take their money and invest somewhere else, or bribe democrats to put loopholes in the tax codes. Only people ending up paying are small business owners and middle class.
parker: “I strongly support cutting off all funds to the PA, but others will pick up the slack.”
True, unfortunately. However, the new donors may eventually weary of supporting them. No one, not even SJWs, likes to be duped.
Dave Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 5:02 pm
Trump really wants to fix problems, which is a big no no in politics and makes him the enemy of professional politicians as their livelihoods depend on prolonging any existing problems to milk them for as long as possible to maintain the status quo or protecting their donors …
* * *
Indeed.
J.J. Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 6:26 pm
parker: “I strongly support cutting off all funds to the PA, but others will pick up the slack.”
True, unfortunately. However, the new donors may eventually weary of supporting them. No one, not even SJWs, likes to be duped.
* * *
The new donors, same as the old donors, don’t give them that much, IIRC. The other Muslim countries give them very little, if any, except for Iran. So maybe they will just say “too bad, so sad, no more money for you today.”
But the SJWs are duped, by definition.
OMG is Nikki Haley mad.
If I were Nikki Haley I’d be mad too.
https://hotair.com/archives/2018/01/26/haley-dare-wolff-insinuate-im-affair-trump/
Aesopsfan, as you know, Israeli politics are pretty complex. Almost every government is a coalition; some strong, some fairly weak. So, while they can unite when there is an immediate crisis, it is hard to muster the “soft line crowd”, which is fairly numerous, for decisive action when the threat is less overtly crucial.
My grand daughter, who is now studying in London, was interested in the concept of parliamentary government. I cited the UK as an example of its strengths, for the most part; and Italy as a prime historic example of its weaknesses–with Israel as a second example of the issues of governing by coalition.
Someone has said: If the Arab states and Iran laid down their arms, tomorrow there could be peace. If Israel laid down their arms, tomorrow there would be no Israel.
I believe that.
Trump ran his campaign saying he was no politician, to good effect. Now he is President, some are surprised that he is not a politician, go figure.
My favorite part of the president’s comments: “or we’re going to have nothing to do with it any longer.” Being willing to walk away from a negotiation is crucial for any chance at getting an agreement that is worthwhile. That aphorism about repetition and insanity comes to mind when thinking about the many decades of peace process that preceded our supposedly boorish president. It’s almost as if the diplomats have been ok with no resolution.
Nikki haley is beautiful, I actually think she is more beautiful than melania, she resembles angie harmon.
Btw, how many men now has the left suggested nikki have had an affair？ they sure dont respect a woman if she is republican and willingly ruin her good name by freely associate her with a man.
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IMO, Israel’s difficulty in solving its ‘Palestinian problem’ is due to two factors, one of which is internal and the other, external.
Israel’s internal problem is the same as ours, a traitorous Left.
Ironically, Israel’s external problem is America. The 1973 Yom Kippur War was nearly fatal for Israel and a consensus of Israelis concluded that Israel could not survive without American support. That belief essentially gave American administrations a de facto veto power over how far Israel can go in its military responses to Islamic aggression.
Not since WWII has America conducted total war upon an enemy. Since then, “Just War Doctrine” has been our practice and we have demanded that Israel emulate it as well.
“If you are going to use military force, then you ought to use overwhelming military force. Use too much and, deliberately use too much; you’ll save lives, not only your own but the enemy’s too. If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting” Gen. Curtis LeMay
Israel has only 27% support from Democrats and other figures here:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/poll-democratic-support-for-israel-palestinians-nearly-identical/
I wonder how deep that 27% support is….
GB, I suspect that Israel could not have survived in 1973 without massive U.S. support. I was deployed in USS John F. Kennedy (CV-67) and had just finished a 7 month deployment to 6th Fleet in the Med. We were turned around and sent back as part of a massive U.S. Naval force, to face down an even more massive USSR force that supported the Arabs. We sat in the Eastern Med Sea and watched a virtual unbroken line of U.S. aircraft carrying supplies to Israel; and guaranteed that the Russians would not intervene.
Two years later, I took command of an A-4 advanced training squadron. Every such squadron had at least two A-4 aircraft sitting in the hangar minus the tail section–which had been shipped to Israel to replace the ones shot up.
The U.S. commitment was enormous, and unevquivocal.
America has a choice: whole heartedly supoort Israel or support Israel half assedly. For 70 years it has been the latter. Curious to see where the former leads.
On the general topic of Trump and foreign policy.
http://thefederalist.com/2018/01/26/3-critical-swamp-myths-trumps-national-security-strategy-exposes/
Oldflyer Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 7:13 pm
Aesopsfan, as you know, Israeli politics are pretty complex.
* *
That’s gotta be the understatement of the year, even with Trump in the game!
I don’t even pretend to understand all the ins-and-outs, but I know that I stand with Israel despite her own politicians and appeasers.
Matthew M Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 7:33 pm
…
It’s
almostas if the diplomats have been ok with no resolution.* * *
If there is peace, they are on the losing side, because that means Israel won.
Geoffrey Britain Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 8:49 pm
IMO, Israel’s difficulty in solving its ‘Palestinian problem’ is due to two factors, one of which is internal and the other, external.
Israel’s internal problem is the same as ours, a traitorous Left.
Ironically, Israel’s external problem is America.
* * *
Oldflyer Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 10:12 pm
GB, I suspect that Israel could not have survived in 1973 without massive U.S. support.
* * *
What I love about this blog is the people who can debate a question because they have boots-on-the-ground experience (even if they are sailors or pilots — not sure there is an equivalent expression for you guys).
Back to GB:
“If you are going to use military force, then you ought to use overwhelming military force. Use too much and, deliberately use too much; you’ll save lives, not only your own but the enemy’s too. If you kill enough of them, they stop fighting” Gen. Curtis LeMay
and “Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet.” Maj. Gen. James Mattis
(Neo, I love love love the edit function. Thankyou Thankyou)
Baklava Says:
January 26th, 2018 at 7:01 pm
OMG is Nikki Haley mad.
If I were Nikki Haley I’d be mad too.
* * *
#NotMeToo now trending….
I remember the State Dept didn’t like a lot of Reagan’s best foreign policy speeches. Lib groupthink is often wrong.
Late comment on a long thread, but:
Trump is not a diplomat. He’s a businessman.
Opened my eyes to why I, unlike everyone else in Western Europe, apparently, like Trump: he reminds me of men I’ve worked for. None of them billionaires, one of them just ran a small business in a basement, but in those circumstances all of them would have said the same thing:
“What? You mean we’re paying these people and we’re getting jack!”.
Gen. Curtis LeMay
What was the difference between LeMay’s firebombing and the Nazi’s plans to create the Ubermensch by assisting the Aryan and the gods in getting rid of the inferior races?
If LeMay’s method is to stop the war, because the Axis were the aggressors, then why was FDR’s warmongering strategies exempted?
That money represents the sweat and toil of hardworking Americans. And the fine, concerned folks involved in “peace proposals” can’t even bring themselves to mention it in negotiations: “We never talk about it”. Screw that.
Of course the Ruling Class and the puppets of the Deep State don’t talk about it.
Do you or we in general, talk about the milk belonging to the cow and needing to return value back to the cow?
Human livestock are merely that: livestock, they exist to be farmed and harvested. What are the complaints going to do, change the Ruling Order of this world? Unlikely, given the elohim in charge.
Ymar,
LeMay opined that had we lost the war, he and all the rest of the Allies military and civilian leadership would most likely have been tried as war criminals.
LeMay was clear eyed on the use of force in war and made no excuses for its inherent brutality.
JJ,
Yes, it’s my impression that US aid was vital to Israel’s survival in the Yom Kippur War. Nevertheless, continued reliance upon US support did give US administrations veto power over extended Israeli military operations.
In Oct of 73, I was an E4 AO on board the USS Constellation (CV-64) returning from a Westpac. I was honorably discharged on the 23rd of Oct. 73. News was very limited back then on a naval vessel at sea and so I missed much that went on.
Trump is taking away the so-called Palestinian punch bowl.
From Arafat on down, every Palestinian considers themselves to be an ARAB.
Gaza is populated by Egyptians, by and large.
It started life as a military outpost — a very dinky one — during WWI.
When the Egyptian forces lost in 1948 they largely fell back into Gaza, then a rump holding signifying nothing much to anyone.
My how things have morphed.
LeMay opined that had we lost the war, he and all the rest of the Allies military and civilian leadership would most likely have been tried as war criminals.
Fortunately for him, if he had some kind of expertise or technical knowledge, the Germans might have just absorbed him into their own programs if he was useful.
The same way the US military lines absorbed Japan’s bio warfare scientists and the German rocket boys like Von Braun, under Operation Paperclip. There’s even a few sources claiming that the US facilitated or evacuated or recruited that infamous human warfare Nazi experimenter, Mengele somebody.
The whole war crimes thing was a smoke screen for political manipulation of human cows that beep like sheep all the time about rah rah patriotism, Red vs Blue. Meanwhile, the Ones in charge, the Elites, dictate pretty much everything.
If the US or the Allies found something useful, they would take it and hide it under a cover of moral supremacy. If the Germans found some Jews useful, or Hitler had too many Jewish relatives, they would overlook things if they had an “honorary” Aryan license, the same one given to Mohammed boys in ME and to Japanese junta in the Far East.
This world is ruled by an Order that is beyond the powers of the USA to change, even the might of the President of the Free World is insufficient against the True Powers That Be.
But Americans couldn’t handle the truth, so nobody told them about these events.
Yes, it’s my impression that US aid was vital to Israel’s survival in the Yom Kippur War.
This was probably that event Nixon was saying, that the Jews would still hate him in the US and vote for his opposition, as Nixon saves Israel. He knew it.
I know and I respect your view but deleting any comment that respctfull beacuse appose your view or dont like it, is ironi and not nice and naive Neo
You living in a world you can hear see people with you others not but not allwing them to express thier thought and share it here it blent and blind and not social respectable
If yii like to be respectable then respct others
(cough) Soros (cough)
1. America’s support is inconceivably important to Israel. Because of media attention and the Jewish/holy land angle, Israel has a media presence waaaaaay larger than its actual physical size. There is an edge in military technology, but even that could probably be swamped by sheer numbers of Jihadis. Israel’s Left would tie the country in knots, preventing any response that involved large scale slaughter. Which leads us to….
2. The main problem in Israel, as everywhere in the West, is suicidal self-hating Lefties. There would be no Palestinian problem to solve if the Left had not stupidly thrown away the moral and military victory of 1967. The Left has spent the years since then making sure that Israel gains no political or moral advantage from that completely justified, defensive war. And they have moved even further to delegitimization of the Zionist enterprise, their own parents’ life cause.
3. Posters here are correct in pointing to the problematic lack of a clear decisive win – especially against an enemy that follows the old “strong horse” rules of common sense, rather than the stupid self-doubting rules of the enervated PC West. That was the opportunity in the 1967 war – it was a clear defeat.
A lot of the people who created Israel were Marxist communists.
This is consistent with the parable that Israel, the 12 tribes, would be scattered and planted in different parts, so that some vines would produce good fruit and others bad fruit.
But it was not the Leftists in Israel that determined that freeing 500-1000 Palestinian prisoners soon to be suicide killers and snipers and bomb makers, for 2 dead Israeli bodies, was a good idea. That was the other factions.
Btw, the state of Israel does not have 12 tribes in it. It barely has 1.5.
As for Soros, people at some blogs actually tried to shame me with their anti American proclamation propaganda, by saying that Soros is just using his freedom of speech and money. Me mentioning his Leftist black ops, was apparently criteria for declaring me an enemy of freedom.
Later on, Soros, smashed their faces in but apparently they can find strangers like me to blame for that. I, however, just observe humans being human retards: they are disciplined by pain because pain is the only thing that works to force them to pay attention.